Saturday, November 14, 2009

Lakota Nation Calls James Arthur Ray on his Disrespect



"They made us many promises, more than I can remember. But they kept but one - They promised to take our land...and they took it."
-- Chief Red Cloud



Last year, James Arthur Ray made approximately $94 million dollars selling his twisted version of Native American Spiritual practices. While on Pine Ridge, the median income on the reservation is just $3,500 a year and the unemployment rate is 85% . City Data Forum


It seems to have escaped the notice of the so-called alternative media that James Ray perverted the birth right and the cultural property of the Lakota people while pulling in roughly 2700 times the average income of the rightful guardians of that culture. The amount Ray made is approximately 1593 times the average income of the residents of the nearest reservation, Camp Verde. The median income there was a mere $8347 in 2000 with a 33% rate of unemployment. Fish and Wildlife Report
To my knowledge, there hasn’t been a single new story that covers the conditions that the rightful owners of Sedona have to live with. All the attention has been on the harm done a handful of non-NDN people. No coverage has been given to the impact that the Sedona deathlodge incident has on indigenous people.



Well, perhaps there’s hope that this injustice will be remedied.



The Lakota Nation has filed suit against James Ray, Angel Valley and the United States government citing the Laramie treaty of 1868.



The plaintiffs listed are Floyd Hand and Ivan Lewis on behalf of the Oglala Nation.
The lawsuit cites articles 1 of the 1868 treaty of Laramie, article 6 of the United States Constitution and articles, 29 and 36 of the United Nations Declaration of the Rights of Indigenous people. The plaintiffs argue that under the customs, traditions and cultural values of the Lakota people the Inipi/Oinikaga ceremony is a way of life, not a religion



They argue that “indigenous people are entitled to the recognition of the FULL OWNERSHIP, control and protection of their cultural and intellectual property. They have the right to special measures of control, develop and protect their sciences, technologies, and CULTURAL MANIFESTATION including human and other genetic resources, seeds, medicines, knowledge of properties of fauna and flora, oral traditions, literature, designs visual and performing arts.” (emphasis mine)



The plaintiffs allege that James Ray violated the peace between the United States government and the Sovereign Lakota Nation by impersonating an Indian and by abusing the cultural property of the Lakota people. The plaintiffs are asking that in order to maintain the treaty of Laramie, that James Ray and the owners of the Angel Valley Retreat center be held accountable and prosecuted under United States law.



If they are successful, and it will be difficult, this will be a ground breaking case in defense of the integrity of Native American spiritual life ways.



You can read the Law suit filed by Floyd Hand and Ivan Lewis to protect the Inipi/Oinikaga here:


Lakota-Lawsuit-Sweat-Lodge



The full statement made by Longblackcat behalf of Lakota Nation is here:

Longblackcat Statement


Full new story here:

Sedona Biz Article


I support the efforts of Floyd Hand and Ivan Lewis 100%. I’d like to call on all NDN-born-NDNS and our true supporters to call the so-called alternative media on not covering the indigenous perspective on this issue. On emphasizing the harm done Non-NDN people and only presenting the opinions of illegitimate representatives of NDN culture. It only takes a minute to send an email to the alternative media and demand that this issue be covered fairly and responsibly.



For the latest updates, you can follow dontpaytopray on twitter




RESOURCES



POVERTY AND RACE






Poorest places in the US




Fish and Wildlife Report Chapter 7 Potential Economic Impacts of Tribal Activities

90 comments:

Anonymous said...

I have heard of our own people charging white people to "participate" in our sacred ceremonies. Anyone hear about the Sundance run by Norman Running? Lots of white people there and I saw a website for a white lady in California that goes to his Sundance and she runs sweats and vision quests. See: http://www.givingspiritform.com/facilitator.html

If you look through her pages on the web site you can see some of the people that was at the Sundance, including some of the "spiritual leaders" she brings out to CA for workshops.

Not out to bad mouth, just wondering if this is the case and if these white people are paying lots to "pray".

Anonymous said...

frauds and dangerous...

Stephanie Rainbow Lightning Elk Wadell - crazy, dangerous and a fraud! http://www.mswsacredjourneys.net/
Runs the Great Turtle Mystery School. You can read all about Laurie Mountain Star Light Higgins' sweat lodge epiphanies:

www.greatturtlemysteryschool.net/Articles/SweatLodge.pdf

Anonymous said...

People have free will and choice in this Great Land. No one owns any ceremony... or words. Why do People want to fight for rights to pray? How much do you think the Catholic Church charges to pray?

Anonymous said...

Sweat Lodge ceremony has been practiced in some form by every culture in the world. How can one culture claim ownership? The issue of skin color is not going to advance us as a human race if that is the focus of legitimacy of native american ceremony. If people could focus more on how we can come together and cease creating more separation - mending the Sacred Hoop - we will move towards the very existence some of us dream of - peace. harmony, and celebration of our diversity on this beautiful planet.
And many religious groups and instituions pass the plate for maintaining operations. It costs money to live in this day and age. Why is money not considered sacred too?

Anonymous said...

I have been in numerous sweat lodges, some run by native bloods and some mixed blood leaders. All have been great experiences. I have been in Rainbow Lightning Elk's sweats and they have been very respectful and honoring of the ancestral lineage with great teachings and compassion for the participants. She cares deeply about healing and restoring balance on mother earth.
Now sweat lodge ceremony happens in many places, and because it is such a powerful and healing ceremony, it is neccessary for more people to participate in it, no matter what color skin they have. Many need this ceremony to strenthen and remember their connection to our Creator. Thank-you to those that carry this sacred lineage.

Barba Rossa said...

Do you remember Robin Hood, who steals from the rich and gives to poor? I think that the core issue of this impending trial is one of fairness and jealousy. The first things written in the original post were stats comparing those on reservation land to this man Arthur Ray and his enterprise. When we play the comparing game, someone always loses. Who Ray was compared to was crafted to draw an emotional response (future jury), and is a direct manipulation. It's not fair that one man can be wealthy while others suffer; well, life isn't fair and that's not Ray's fault. It feels like indigenous rights and culture are being used as grounds to restore "fairness", which is as equally corrupt as the man accused. That set aside, let's work toward some evolution. How many PEOPLE's lives will be affected positively if all of the teachings of past cultures locked in a box under federal law? Big picture: learn from the past and advance forward. This trial is a sidetrack and may have severe world consequences. This country is in dire need of deepened thought / awareness. Why now are these cultures being protected from evil men? Or are they being withheld from the greater good and their greater purpose? And for Rainbow Lightning Elk's inclusion: I have participated in her sweats many times both inside and outside tending the ceremonial flames. She has an unhuman capacity for acceptance and care and is in no way connected to the Laramie Treaty or any ensuing legal squabbles.

Anonymous said...

People have a right to all of our lineages, freedom of speech, freedom of religion, freedom to make a choice. Where ever we get our training and teaching is where we get our training and teaching. This is about Honoring the Ceremony, trying to keep it going, bringing beauty and much needed healing to Grandmother Earth and those that need it. A Ho!

Anonymous said...

Sacred Ceremonies are not only for the Native American People. They are for all People of any color and any race. The time for more harmony between people of this Great Earth, working together to create more balance, harmony, and alignment with the four worlds,IS HERE.
You can choose to stay RIGID in your traditions and beliefs....
just see where this is going to take you....People are hungry for Ancient Knowledge and ways to heal their Hearts! LET THEM!
Your way is not the only way!
Going from being oppressed to being the oppressor, is not a very good choice for spiritual evolution.
....and yes TODAY IS A GOOD DAY TO DIE.
Walk in Beauty

Osage said...

Accusations must be proven in order to have significance. People pointing fingers are looking at a mirror of self reflection and must be able to see themselves clearly first to know if there statements are TRUTH. Stephanie Wadel knows how to honor the sacred space of the sweat lodge as well as any body in my experience, Lakota sweats included. Many can attest to this statement. She was trained and carries on a lineage with yet more weaving than previous generations which in turn had more weaving than in previous generations etc. We have all seen how pure bred animals often carry weaknesses that Mixed Blood animals overcome. Ceasing the mixing of lineages and teachings is a questionable stance when all of life's cycles encourage otherwise. Honor those that honor and protect in integrity and with compassion yet fight like a warrior for what is right.

Peter the cyber Akicita said...

All the Anonymous cowards and Osage are full of shit! Stephanie "Rainbow Elk Lighting Fire woman" Wardell is a NEW AGE FRAUD! http://www.extatica.com/SexEducation/RS_StephanieRainbow_SexualShamanism.htm
She should be arrested, fined and/or imprisoned for fraudulent misrepersentation and consumer fraud.
She doesn't know the first thing about Lakota protocal and she certainly isn't qualified to lead a sweat.
Natives who charge foolish whites for ceremony are called twinkies and are universally despised in NDN Country. White people who think they can BUY Native Spirituality from a stranger for a price are fools who deserve to loose their money. They don't deserve to loose their lives.
Idiot apoligists who claim that no-one owns ceremony and that OUR SACRED CEREMONIES are for everyone are ALWAYS attached to New Age frauds and exploiters. MONEY is ALWAYS their bottom line. You can't trust them and should never fall for their sleazy rhetorical tricks. No authenitic medicine people make this vapid argument. Whites always think they have a right to everything the NDN owns. New Agers, Pilgrims, Calvary, Missionaries, they're all the same. The can never escape their greed for what they lack. American is spiritually bankrupt because of its own choosing. Until Americans take responsibility for the poor choices they've made in destroying this beautiful land, the Lakota will have nothing to do with their pitiful "seekers". If you want to be spiritual, first you must be HONEST. New Agers are the most dishonest people who have ever lived on this planet. They can't come to terms with being the descendents of slave owners and genocidal maniacs. They want to erase Manifest Destiny form the history books and replace it with crystals and rainbows. The rightful guradians of Lakota ceremony have closed it to non-NDNS. This is the right thing to do. There is nothing more to say on this matter. Whether or not whites get their feelings hurt by having their intellectual, moral and spiritual bankruptcy revealed is irrelevant to the spirits. Spiritual growth requires painful revelations about one's shadow. Anyone who tells you they know of someone who conducts sweats for whites respectfully and with the permission of authentic teahcers is a LIAR and a FRAUD. Beware of the type of Anonymous cowards who want to keep the frauds in business. White people, stay out of New Age cults and start getting very, very honest with yourself about your whiteness. Only then will we ever consider "sharing" anything spiritual with you.

Grandma Bea from NB said...

Anonymous cowards,
The Sweat Lodge (Inipi) ceremony has NOT been practiced in some form by every culture in the world. This is a very popular lie among monies white New Agers that has been repeated so often that is has become "truth" among the dishonest descendents of those who perpetuated genocide on the indigenous population of this hemisphere. You do violence to the truth when you mindlessly repeat the lies that New Age businesses use to justify further exploitation of Native American spiritual ways. Arvol Looking Horse, the 19th generation bundle keeper is the rightful GUARDIAN of the sacred ceremonies. Native people do not say we "own" ceremonies. This is a straw man argument created by some very disrespectful and dishonest New Age business owners in order to distract attention away from the real issues. They are the FOX News of the pseudo-spiritual set, if you will. You are extremely foolish to mindlessly parrot clichés without checking your facts. Like all New Age apologists, our "opinion" is not informed by fact. If the New Age had any people who were truly spiritual in it, or truly moral, they would respect the basic HUMAN RIGHTS of indigenous people to control and to keep the integrity of the culture that THYE created. This is not about race, it's about CULTURE. Native ceremonies are practiced in Native communities, for Native communities and by Native communities. Any person of any race who can demonstrate sufficient HUMILITY and HONEST can be invited to participate. This almost NEVER happens because there are so few non-Indians who can be honest about anything. Participation in Native American Indian ceremony requires a ceremonial lifestyle.

Grandma Bea from NB said...

This road is too difficult for outsiders. Our ceremonies are a way of life, NOT a religion in the limited, primitive white Capitalist Christians understanding of religion. Foolish non-Indians think they can mimic the outward forms of our ceremonies on the week end and that somehow gets rid of all their white guilt and makes them less white. This error in thinking is on WHITES, not on the American Indian.
Disrespect and exploitation from outsiders forced us to protect what is our birth right to protect.
We were forced to close our ceremonies to outsiders who do not understand them because they don't speak the language, they don't know the songs and the customs and they REFUSE to learn the true meaning and symbolism behind them.
No one has the right to pervert the religion of another group - especially if that person is from a powerful group with a history of GENOCIDE against the powerless group. This issue is of OUR RELIGIOUS FREEDOM - not YOUR freedom to consume and pollute whatever you like. Non-Indians habits of taking and polluting are destroying this planet. Why would Indians trust you with something as sacred as a ceremony when you have destroyed everything you've ever taken from us? We GAVE you the gift of tobacco and look what you did with that. You STOLE our land and our resources and look what you did with that. Indians would have to be insane to think that anything has changed.

We were forced to close our ceremonies to keep outsiders from RAPING them. Every human being has the right to self-defense. You forced us to act in self-defense of your continual spiritual and cultural rape. Non-Indians don't understand our ways. Non-Indians think they know better than our elders. Non-Indians refuse to follow all of our protocols and values; they refuse to be humble, to sacrifice for others, to think of the 7th generation, to love the while community and care for everyone in it. They compete with each other to see who can win the most converts and evangelize our religion the fastest. This is a perversion. Non-Indians want a short cut and an easy means to making people think they are "spiritual" they don't want to do the hard work it takes to be spiritual. They live in denial of their history and can't be honest with themselves about who they really are and where their wealth really comes from. No one living in denial as an American Capitalist consumer is cut out to be a "spiritual" person. This is a hard truth that you will not hear. You invent elaborate justifications for taking the easy way out. You look for frauds and New Age gurus who run dangerous cults designed only to make more and more money. You do everything except look at yourselves honestly. America IS spiritually bankrupt. The solution to this is not so easy as looking once again to the American Indian to take all the we have left. This is how your ancestors got you into this situation - taking from the Indian and polluting and destroying everything you have taken and NEVER, EVER giving anything back in return. The reaction from the "Anonymous Cowards" on this page only convince our true spiritual elders that non-Indians have a lot of work to do on themselves before we can associate with them. It is a basic human right to protect our culture, land and life ways from pollution by the greedy invaders. It is the Anonymous cowards supporting exploitation that need to take a good look at who they really are. The Indian already sees who you are.

Bemused Skeptical Atheist said...

Stephanie Rainbow Elk Lighting Fire woman crystal sucking bliss bunny Wardell is a FRAUD. Women don't Sundance, dumb ass. All you need is a brain to see that she's a New Age whacko. You'd have to be a brainwashed member of some bliss-bunny New Age cult not to see how fake and phoney this nut case is. Every citizen of the United States is subject to the 1868 Treaty of Laramie. If enforced, this bliss bunny would be in jail along side James Arthur Ray and the owners of Angel Valley. I see James Ray has is Public Relations people out in full force posting anonymous comments no any blog that dares to criticize the great greedy Capitalist. You're not fooling anyone. James Ray is going down. He fucked over rich white people this time instead of powerless NDNS. He's going to jail. The question is will he make a deal or will he flee the country to avoid prosecution?

Horseheart said...

I agree that respect is lacking in this country and that by walking our talk - as one hearted humans respect for each other will happen, Many of us mixed blooded people have our native ancestry coursing through our veins strongly. And can hear the voices of our native ancestors. And can walk this Earth with honor and respect praying for more to do the same. it could possibly take "white skinned"people that are mixed bloods to awaken others. Everyone needs to awaken. I agree that People need to remember and reconnect to their hearts - and stop ravaging this planet, so that we ALL can remember our connection to one another. I honor and thank the indigenous people of this land that carry and conduct the sacred ceremonies. I say thank-you for your ways, ceremonies, what you stand for, your strength, courage, and balance. I have deep sadness and shame about the history of the government and leaders in this country and the many many dishonest actions taken against the First Nations peoples. I believe that it is the duty and call from Great Spirit for ALL of us -to do our part in returning the sacredness and balance to Life on Grandmother Earth. I feel that Rainbow Lightning Elk assists greatly in this movement. I walk as a more sacred human with honor and respect for my native lineage - for the 4 worlds - for the sacredness, honor, respect, and gratitude for all that have gone before.
I agree that non- full bloods must respect and appreciate what the First Nations people share. I firmly believe that there are many that do this and that connect deeply with their ancestral indigenous knowledge and training and are as valid and beneficial in the awakening ALL people to walk in balance and re-connect with their own Spirit and Great Spirit - Wankan Tanka. True power is wisdom in remembering the total journey. I pray we come together to find the places we can respect and work together as sacred humans with open hearts in healing the imbalances on Grandmother Earth.

Owl Eyes said...

Authenticity. Reverence. Honor. the Sacred. Integrity. Light. Intention. Prayer. Forgiveness. Healing. Respect. Commitment. When these are present, a resonance of TRUTH is present. It is palpable. Such is the case with every SweatLodge I have been to led by Stephanie Rainbow Lightning Elk. Without question, she brings into the SweatLodge the qualities of what it is to be a Sacred Human in alignment and in balance with all of Grandmother Earth’s Children. Even moreso than lodges I have been to led by “natives”.

Please, people, have a direct experience with someone/something before making blanket statements. At this time, on our Sacred Mother, every thought, word, action is important. YES, we must all be accountable for our individual and collective realities! Native and non-native, alike. If there is imbalance of any kind, what can we each do within ourselves to heal it? Going outside of ourselves - to blame, for validation - will backfire on all of us every time. This is true for everyone, regardless of our skin color. At this time, we must draw on the strengths of every culture, every color of people -- the red, black, white, yellow, and métis (mixed blood) people. And yes, with HONOR, RESPECT, and GRATITUDE. The SweatLodge ceremony is a ceremony of purification from which everyone can benefit. Let us truly honor Mother Earth by honoring everyone’s right to Healing and Purification. Great Spirit knows we all need it! As each of us heals, Mother Earth heals. We are ALL interconnected.

PHuck Da Nuage said...

Owl Eyes, charging people with making "blanket statements" when they are really talking about very, specific misdeeds done by some very arrogant, disrespectful people is an old rhetorical trick. It may work with the scientific and cultural illiterates that you hang with, but SKINS demand a higher standard of logic and reason. You have confused Native people with the brain-dead bliss bunnies who will believe anything that a guru or spiritual huckster has to say.
Horseheart, spare us the Nazi blood theory. Everything you are mindlessly repeating comes directly from the NAZI occult. It is not appropriate here. Take your idiotic white supremacist views elsewhere. Blood doesn't "remember". This theory was created in Nazi Germany in the 1930s to form a pagan Nationalist movement that could take over the world. You sound like either a Rainbow or a Zeitgeister and both of those groups are dangerous, irrational white supremacists. Stop wasting our time with your silly arguments, your self pity and your illusions that you are "awake." That crap is racist and anti-democratic and the majority of the people on the planet won't accept New Age-Rainbow Family-All-is-One neo-Nazi spiritual facism. If you had ever spent even one minute with REAL Native people, you would realize that the dishonest forms of manipulation you are attempting to use don't work on REASONABLE people. Go back to your fluff bunny patch and don't even think you can lecture Native people, you arrogant hypocrite!

TAX NUAGE CULT$ said...

What nerve to imply that somehow Native American people can be “racist”! Those of you who reap all the underserved benefits of our almost total cultural spiritual and physical annihilation have got no right to call anybody a racist. The sheer gall and limitless arrogance! The only RACISM going on here was in the economically/socially sere-gated community of Sedona. I’m sick of all these nons whining about how racist we are for asserting our basic human right to preserve the integrity of the only thing we have left that they haven’t stolen, destroyed and polluted – OUR spiritual ways.

Culture belongs to the people who create it. The Lakota have every right to assert their rights to their cultural property. Not the parasites who sold their souls for prestige, wealth, power and a luxurious lifestyle that the majority of the planet can’t even hope for.It’s interesting how these people who are so concerned about fighting racism know absolutely nothing about the extreme poverty and soul-crushing daily racism that poor people of color have to deal with in order for them to enjoy their underserved lifestyles. How does it escape your notice that James Ray is a rich white man? Each and every person who attended his seminars were rich white people. James Ray’s sweat lodge was racially segregated, but the hypocrites who think they can pilfer someone else’s spirituality are willfull blind to this fact. The deathlodge was segregated by power, wealth and political influence, but non one whining nuage apologist has any criticisms of the most racially segregated religion that has ever existed on this land – neo-paganism.

It is no accident that James Ray chose Sedona to hold his WHITES ONLY bastardization of a sweat lodge ceremony. The media is spinning this story to make it seem like the people who dies were blameless angels, but this couldn’t be further from the truth. In order to attend a spiritual warrior retreat, the deathlodge cult members must have invested at least $30,000.00 in previous ‘seminars’ where high pressure sales techniques and thought stopping activities were used to break down their critical thinking skills and convince them that only James Rays brand of spiritual hucksterism could save them from their awful lives before James Ray.

There is a whole other aspect to his deathlodge cult that is not being reported, either by the white owned and control mainstream media, or the white owned and controlled “leftist” “alternative media. James Ray took the Inipi and stripped it of its true meaning. He used its empty carcass as a marketing ploy in order to sell white supremacist neo-Nazi fantasies to rich white people who were more than happy to pay him thousands of dollars to reinforce and support their preconceived racist perspectives about the racist society where they enjoy a place at the very top. You haven’t heard about what “teachings” were being sold to the all white death cult in the name of freedom of religion.

Sedona is a hotbed for spiritual Aryanism. There are more people practicing and spreading Nazi occult beliefs in Sedona, Taos, Santa Fe, Belgium, England, and Australia than there were Germany in the 1930s and 40s.When one enters a New Age cult, one is told that he or she is now “awake”. A line is drawn between those who are “awake” (rich, white and spiritually enlightened) and those who are “not awake” (people of color fighting for social justice, atheists, skeptics and the most despised of all – Jews).

One is slowly indoctrinated by thought stopping activities, sleep and food deprivation and heavy peer pressure to believe that members of the cult are superhuman descendants from the Pleiades. They are told that they are now part of the brotherhood and sisterhood of the “Light,” They are taught the Blavatsky root race theory, but the blatant racism is changed to more subtle racism. The Aryans become the Peiadian hybrids. The White brotherhood becomes a brother hood of the Light.

TAX NUAGE CULT$ part 2 said...

The 6th Aryan root race is called something like the indigo children or a race of reincarnated American Indians who were born to fulfill the fictitious Hopi or Mayan prophesies which are manipulated to serve the political agenda of the particular guru leading the cult.

The indoctrination comes slowly over long periods of time. Only after more and more money is invested are the truly shocking and ugly beliefs of the cult revealed. This is so the cult member is reluctant to leave the program until he or she sees a return on their money. The people attending the sweat lodge were a few steps away from being able to make large sums of money by becoming leaders in the cult and leaving their status of apprentice. This is why they stayed in – RAW GREED and AMBITIOIN.

They had come to the point where their believed they were the “evolved” higher root race that was created by superior aliens from the Pleiades and they were born to create ceremonies that would bring back a glorious Matriarchal pagan past. They paid huge sums of money for herbal detoxification remedies and monatomic gold power that when used with the chants and songs they were taught was supposed to raise their level of vibration and make them super human. James Ray convinced them that if they did as they were instructed they would ascend to a higher dimension and become more than human and this would lead them to great wealth and the credentials to lead the same type of fake ceremonies that he was getting rich off of.

There’s much more to this cult, but they members bonded around being educated, white middle class people who had already been told all their lives that they were more deserving of the education and opportunities that had been given to them ONLY because of their skin color. The racism here lies entirely in the minds of educated, privileged whites who have been told all their lives by society that they enjoy more privileges in a
racist society because they’ve earned them. Lakota religioin is all about clan and family. You have to be related – have a tiopysoye and a lifetime commitment to a ceremonilal way of life to be involved in these rights. It’s insane for nons to come around pretending you can just step into somebody ELSE’s family and understand the customs and traditions. Only a mentally unbalanced person would try to insert themselves in a fmily that they didn’t belong to. It’s not about race, it’s about mental health. When these nons are told that they don’t fit into a culture they weren’t raised in, there next step is to try to buy what they want. Their love of the power of money always brings them to cults. James Ray knew exactly how to manipulate rich white people. He gave them what they really wanted - permission to purify themselves of compassion for the poor, the wage slaves, the homeless and especially the American Indian. He told them the American Indian was like a monkey whose only purpose was to guard the spiritual secrets until the superior Pleidian hybrid master race “awakened” to assume their true place of leadership in a “New World.”

If you do any research at all on cults, you will find that they target, successful, educated white idealistic people with access to wealth. Cults have no use for poor people without skills that can earn the cult money. James Ray’s deathlodge cult existed for two purposes only – to get more members, and to amass more wealth for those at the top of the cult pyramid. The cult members were used and exploited by James Ray, but the bait he used was their early indoctrination into white supremacists notions. If they hadn’t half-believed their were racially superior and entitled to take anything valuable from the racially inferior Indians, James Ray could have never hooked them in the first place. There are no innocent victims here, save the D/N/Lakota people. My solution is to TAX these nuage businesses out of existence. Only when the profit is taken out of the flim-flam business will the nons will stop exploiting our ways.

RED ALERT - PERVERTS IN SHAMANS CLOTHING said...

ANYONE WHO HAS ANYTHING TO DO WITH THE FAKE AND PHONY STEPHANIE WADELL SHOULD READ THIS FIRST:

Stephanie is involved with Harley Reagan's Deer Tribe Medicine Society. Harley was the first plastic shame-on to kill someone in a vision quest in the 1980s.

This was posted some time age on the New Age Frauds Plastic Shamans message forum:

http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=944.0

"The deer tribe ain't Metis (there are real Metis people it isn't just a fancy name for mixed blood) and they are perverts. Yup. I said it. Having orgies is not scared Indian ceremony. And there grand guru, Harley Reagan, advocayes people teaching youing children to have sex. That's pervert stuff to me. n the archives there is more on Harley Reagan aka Harley swift deer. Fake Cherokee. Fake medicine man. Fake war hero. Fake human too as far as I sam concerned."

"You were right to be skeptical Deb. Anytime you see "Pleidian lightwork" or other obivous nonsense pretending to be Native, trust your instinct. If it doesn't pass the Laugh Test or the Vomit Test (if it makes you want to laugh, or to vomit when they teach people to have sex with kids) it's fraud.

"May the Great Turtle love you into your Sacred Destiny by becoming your magical mysterious character."

Absurd stuff like that...
I can do without turtlelove, thanks. I just get this vision of a turtle trying to hump my leg like a dog does, except very slowly.

"Fee Exchange:
$610 for each New Moon "Turtle" weekend
$2,440 financial commitment fee due by the New Moon on June 25, 2006
$1,000 fee for CEREMONIAL WEEK due by the New Moon in March, 2007"

I hope your friend didn't fall for this. If she did, please urge her to sue.

More importantly, warn her as loud and as often as you can, THE DEER TRIBE OFTEN SEXUALLY ASSAULTS WOMEN, often by claiming it's part of a "ceremony."

They routinely gang rape their women members, or get the men and women to assault each other, as a way of breaking down their resistance.

If this happened to her, go straight to the cops and the district attorney. This cult is incredibly dangerous, not simply bizarre...

"But these "teachers" are victims themselves. Some of what they went through is pretty disturbing.
..."Also keep in mind the Deer Tribe is heavily armed, has survivalist and militia ties, and has proclaimed at times they are preparing for a race war."

It's not just stupid white people who suffer from frauds. Most of them are perverts who molest little kids too. Mala Spotted Eagle Pope raped a little 10 year old girl - Celestia beacause her nutty mother drank the cool-aid and handed an innocent child over to one of these plastic shame-men.

This crap needs to be taxed and regulated. It should be illegal to impersonate an American Indian the same way it's illegal to impersonate a priets or a police officer. James Ray needs to be in jail and you need to watch out for his followers too - They'll be the next generation of con-artists trying to cash in on the spirituality craze in this spiritual desert!

Never give up your right to think and question people who claim to be authorities - especially if someone is telling your how loving and caring they are -- check your wallet!

One who watches and waits said...

IMHO Sedona is one of the creepiest places on the planet. There are hundreds and hundreds of sweats being conducted by people who honestly believe they are alien-hybrids from the Pleiades who must raise the vibration of the human race in order to save the planet. Maybe Floyd Hand should sue the entire city of Sedona? There are millions of these dangerous New Age nutcases all over the world, just waiting for the New Age rapture to come and take away all the bad, evil people who still possess critical thinking skills. I don't have much faith in Floyd Hand's lawsuit, however, as he was all mixed up with these Pleiadian nutcases years ago as was Leonard Crow Dog.
Seems to me the Lakota should learn to contol their own people first before they go around suing others.
http://www.drboylan.com/strknrpt2.html

watermix said...

I agree America is in need of spirituality and honesty. Why hide a sacred and beautiful ceremony that creates the wheel for healing! America is a nation of many peoples - all in need of hope and harmony. All in need of Ceremony. I have gratitude to the lineages that have continued these teachings and ceremony from many generations ago.
The intention should not be to divide according to how much "whiteness" one possesses. The intention should be to honor the Ceremony. Rainbow Lightning Elk honors the Ceremony of the Sweat Lodge! The healing goes out to the community and to the collective.

Skeptical Saganite said...

There is no indigenous person alive who wouldn't be deeply offended by the nuage rubbish that Stephanie Wadell is selling. The nuage bunk that she’s hawking is about as real as her hair color! I noticed that as soon as she was exposed as the fraud she truly is on this blog, she removed her erotic website. How authentic is that? Destroying the evidence before the Lakota came after her with a big lawsuit! A real medicine people would never put up a website, let alone an "erotic" one. Indigenous people are offended by the combination of “tantic sex” and the sacred rite of the Inipi. What Wadell is doing is pure desecration. Every word she says is antithetical to true cosmological and spiritual teachings of the D/N/Lakota people.
For the ignorant and uninformed, let me elaborate:
1.) She calls herself a "shaman". This is a Siberian term and does NOT refer to any legitimate indigenous spiritual practitioner. It is a term used almost exclusively by nuage frauds to trick gullible hyper-credulous people into surrendering their money
2.) She combines "tantric" principles into the sweat lodge. Not only is this profoundly offensive to true D/N/Lakota spiritual elders, it is evidence of fraud. Indigenous spiritual practices are whole and complete and DO NOT require supplements from other belief systems. Anyone with even the most minimal training would understand this. A sure sign of fraud is the incorporation of tarot cards, astrology, sacred geometry, reiki or obscene "tantric" practices with pay-to-pray schemes like Wadell is running.
3.) I contacted several official tribal offices and no-one has any knowledge of a Rainbow Lightning Elk who is either associated with any D/N/Lakota tribe in any way or qualified to run sweats or to Sundance. They have no knowledge of anyone by that name ever having assisted in an authentic Sundance at any time. Most of the indigenous representatives I contacted were horrified that Ms. Waddell was desecrating the sweat lodge by using dubious sexual practices with them. Many of them urged me to encourage anyone who has seen such practices to contact the authorities in the areas where these sweats are being conducted. The D/N/Lakota do not mix sexes in sweat lodges, nor do they incorporate bizarre nuage sexual practices into their sweats. This is considered a desecration of a sacred rite.
4.) Ms. Wadell has claimed that she is a “FireWoman” within the “Chuluaqui-Quodoushka tradition”. These are fabrications created by the well-known nuage fraud Harley Reagan of the fraudulent Deer Tribe Medicine Society. This is NOT a legitimate indigenous organization. She claims association with the Deer Tribe Medicine Society which is well known to be a fraudulent organization. No one in it has any legitimate connection to any Federally recognized American Indian tribe. Harley "Swiftdeer" Reagan and the "Deer tribe," are all bogus Indian groups or spiritual leaders that fleece naive non-indians who want to learn about Indian spirituality. They have been denounced by every legitimate Native American spiritual leader since the late 1980s. Harley “Swiftdeer” Reagan was the first person to kill a man in a plastic vision quest in 1980 (see memoriam in this blog) Ms. Wadell also claims to be a member of the “Butterfly Clan” of North Idaho. There is no such clan in any tribe that is located in Northen Idaho. She is lying, making false claims and claims to be from a group of people who have been exposed as frauds and sexual perverts decades ago.
5.) Ms. Wadell is making extraordinary claims about her entitlement to conduct sweat lodges. By all rules of logic, extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof. I contacted Ms. Wadell and she refused to provide the name of even ONE tribally enrolled member of a federally recognized tribe who could speak for her. If her sweat lodges are so wonderful, then why is there not even ONE, federally recognized D/N/Lakota tribal representative who is willing to vouch for her?

Skeptical Saganite said...

6.) All “evidence” on the internet would suggest that Ms. Waddell is just a common prostitute who calls herself a “sexual surrogate” and has taken on the trappings of the Lakota in order to promote her unlawful business. Stephanie Wadell’s “Fire Magic” amounts to nothing more than prostitutuion. She may call it “sacred prostitution” and claim to sell the lost ceremonies of “sexual magick”, but she learned all her “tricks” from the pervert Harley Reagan and sick and twisted members of his Deer Tribe Medicine Society. The Attorney General in whatever state she lives in should be alerted as to her “sexual surrogate services” and her “Lonely Knights” services which are merely fronts for prostitution. Her website should be shut down for promoting illegal activity.


There many more obvious warning signs this woman is a spiritual huckster, but they are too numerous list in this brief space. Non-Indians should be very careful of anyone associated with the Deer Tribe Medicine Society. To learn more about these dangerous perverts, go to New Age Frauds Plastic Shamans thread:
http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1333.0
Read the comments on this blog:
http://mymutterances.blogspot.com/2009/06/harley-swiftdeer-reagan.html
Read this blog
http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=50839

There is no such thing as “sacred prostitution” in any indigenous spiritual tradition. All of Ms. Wadell’s teachers are frauds and she is a fraud also. Legitimate medicine people don't list known frauds as their teachers. No one in their right mind who did any responsible research would believe that Stephanie Waddell is running a legitmate business. These people making apologies for her on this site surly have a financial stake in her prostitution business. The sooner criminals like Wadell and Reagan are behind bars, the better. The death of a silly rich person, is not the worst thing that could happen in a plastic sweat lodge. Lots of irresponsible parents join these nuage cults and hand their innocent children over to perverts who scar them for life. There needs to be legislation to shut down fake Indian businesses as soon as possible. We all need to write our elected officials and demand that something be done to put people like James Ray, Stephanie Wadell and Harley Reagan behind bars so they can’t hurt anyone else. I applaud Floyd Hand and Ivan Lewis for taking the first step to stop the abuse of indigenous spiritual practices.

Not a nice NDN said...

watermix,
You are a fool. You mindlessly spout all the right words that you think will manipulate us emotionally to give you what you want. It doesn't work with real people who possess critical thinking skills. The D/N/Lakota have EVERY right to protect what is sacred to them from abuse and exploitation from foolish outsiders who have no respect for protocol and no intention to keep our sacred rites in their integrity. To practice Native ceremonies, you MUST speak the language, live in a Native community and be trained for years and years to understand the culture, the meaning of the songs and prayers and the symbolism. No outsider has been willing to do this. They all want to use our sacred rites to promote their Feminist, Environmental, or other politica agendas. This is sacrilege. You falsely make this about "race" in order to win your argument because that is all you care about - winning and getting your way. That is why YOU CANNOT BE TRUSTED with our sacred rites. YOU cannot be honest. YOU cannot be humble. YOU cannot respect the TRUTH. You twist and exploit words to make theft seem like borrowing to make integrity seem like greed and you gladly speak obscenities like calling money, "green energy". You MUST have a tiyospaye - band or extended family group to practice our spiritual ways. It's about FAMILY and RELATIONSHIP. You are foolish to ask for something you know nothing about with the arrogant assumption that this will heal all the is wrong with you. THE ONLY THING THAT CAN HEAL THE WHITEMAN IS HIS COMMITMENT TO COMPLETE HONESTY. YOU CANNOT COMMIT TO HONESTY.

Grandmother Elk said...

Do Lakota's mothers teach their children to hate white man?
If this is the case I consider you very unhuman and dengerous.
We are not new age.
JUST STOP THE WAR!
Why do you want to perpetuate the painfull experience, instead of evolving by ending the hate and the anger towards white man?
Blessing to you Lakota Tribe.
Much healing needs to take place

Anonymous said...

To Grandma Bea from NB -
Sweats have been practiced by other cultures for purification and cleansing, prayer and community, although through time, some of the spiritual aspect has been lost. I didn't say or mean that the Native American Sweat Lodge (Inipi) ceremony is practiced all over the world. I do know that that many tribes in America hold Sweat Lodges, and have been for a long time. I am not trying to exploit anything. I understand that this is a very sacred, ancient ceremony in Native culture. But it has gone out to the collective. We can't go back. And there are MANY mixed bloods that have a right to learn about their lineage and culture! And to do it with honor, integrity, and respect is very important. I am grateful for this as a mixed blood person. There is nothing pseudo spiritual, dishonest, or disrespectful about the Sweat Lodge ceremonies I have experienced. They have been with strict protocal and integrity. I agree that Native people should keep the integrity of their culture! I support that! But this point you make about all "whites" is racist. Many have done the things you say - but many have not. You don't know who I am - or where I have been or what I have done. Your classification of "white" is narrow minded and does not allow for healing of the separation that I want to heal. The coming together with open hearts of native and mixed bloods - in honor and respect is what is needed. Again, I am grateful to the elders and keepers of the sweat lodge ceremony. Many Indians and Mixed Bloods have lost their connection with their cultures. I see that this is a neccessary part of the movement towards peace. People MUST find their connections and it is the First Nations realations that we need to know! It is time to come together and find where we can speak the same language. I want to work for the solutions and not perpetuate the problem! WE must end this talk of who belongs and who doesn't. Rage, oppression, poverty, is also a state of mind - when are we going to focus on unity, peace, respect, working together? I'm ready for this dialogue. I am tired of war. There are many out there that do lead "ceremonial" lives that aren't full blood. We live in a time where talk of harmony and honor and education of culture to reconnect to our ancestors is crucial. I applaude your efforts to keep integrity in the First Nations peoples' culture. I support it. As a “mixed blood” I am greatful to my ancestors who have been willing to share the teachings and traditions with genuine students.
My prayer is that this will lead more to their roots, lineage, culture and re-store respect in our country, for the First Nations people, respect for the wisdom of our elders and listening to one another so we can all come together for peace in this land. To All My Relations!

Anonymous said...

To Grandma Bea from NB
I speak out again.....
I feel strongly about the sacredness and integrity of the Sweat Lodge ceremony because it has helped me greatly in healing from the loss of my husband (of 25 years) in March of 2008 at the age of 53 years. The deep connection I felt from being able to sweat after this huge loss has been instrumental in my being able to carry on and find some peace and connection with all of the worlds of Creation. The connection and communal aspects that I have found and nurture are immeasurable and I have deep gratitude to those that have kept the "door open" for the opportunity to experience this beautiful ceremony. To All my Realations

Anonymous said...

The Sweat Lodge Ceremony led by Stephanie Rainbow Lightning Elk has nothing to do with Harley SwiftDeer and the Deer Tribe. It is a lineage from the mixed bloods of Turtle Mountain in North Dakota and Canada and comes from the teachings of Grandfather EagleHeart. It is a community sweat lodge that was brought through EagleHeart's teachings and passing it on. We were at his SunDance in North Dakota and he is a Mixed Blood, French and Chippawea and other bloods. Get real, most of us on the planet right now are mixed bloods. The Metis, mixed blood, People have a rightful designation as a Tribe in Canada and parts of North Dakota and have suffered from both sides of white and red ways. Perhaps some Lakota people need to do better research....... where Rainbow Lightning Elk's sweat lodge comes from.

Anonymous said...

"Sacred Prostitute" is not what Stephanie Rainbow Lightning Elk Wadell calls herself. This was a title of someone else's book, Ray Stubbs. His take on the matter of sexuality and culture. Stephanie was trained as a sexual surrogate partner and that is a valid training developed by Masters and Johnson to help dysfunctional people. Do your research. There are still and have been Rites of Passage Ceremonies for young People in many cultures.... the Hawaiians, the Apache, in Australia, South America.... Anyone in puberty will tell you that they could use a hands on teacher because this American culture is so repressive around sexuality. Ask them. They can think even if they are in puberty. The teachings of Harley SwiftDeer are valid in what he learned from his Cherokee Grandmother. This is still a free country and people have the right to choose what speaks to them. Why do the Jewish People not condemn those who want to convert? They were persecuted, too. Why do the Hawaiians accept white looking people who want to learn the ancient hula or chants for healing? What is with the Lakota hate mongers that they cannot accept the World the why the Great Mystery is unfolding it?

Barba Rossa said...

I am not writing on the subject of rights / ownership of indigenous ceremony. I am in no mood to confront anyone's resistance towards mutual respect and am hereby denouncing all of the intellectual b.s.
This forum sounds like a high school cafateria, nothing but gossip and gutter talk. I am fucking furious at all of the calumnious statements directed at Rainbow Lightning Elk. I am sick of all you people speaking fghting words from behind the safety veil of your computer screens. You think she's a mindless whore?! I'm young and srtong as hell; I've got hard knuckles and a hard stare. Do you think you would have the cojones to say what you've been saying to R.L.E. face to face if I were beside her burning you with my retinas? I am having an extremely difficult time staying on top of my emotions; I'm pissed. Just know, if you all were something real to me, not just an electronic idea, I would break your face against the concrete, I would make you bow to Rainbow's feet for the level of your disrespect. The fruits of revenge are always far more bitter than expected. If you are indeed spritual, than your cowardice will soon be made visible. 1210 del oro, santa barbara CA. I don't sleep. How's that for new age fuckers

Barba Rossa said...

Empty threats. If I were a healthier person, these name calling words would just run through me or bead off of me. I want to appreciate this internet page for allowing me to speak openly and let go of some of my anger. It was the word 'prostitute' that did it to me. I will retract my claims; after writing I don't feel so bad. Well, now my pathology is permanently displayed; I'll go be in shame, or maybe pride, I don't know. Once again thanks

Anonymous said...

I really think that arguing over these points is usefuly, except for the use of some language. However, I disagree with the rationalization that, "all cultures" participated in Sweat Lodges. Heck, not all Native people did until after the 1970's when there was an explosion or momvement to go back to these ways to help us. I also do not agree with people using Black Elk's word that these ways are meant to help all the people....keep in mind when he was telling his stories. He was under the impression that ALL of it would be gone by now. His words should not be used as an "allowance" for this to happen. How many people remember Arvol Looking Horse and Bernard Red Cherries movement to "Protect" these ceremonies. I remember, at a meeting at Bear Butte, our Lakota spiritual leaders questioned his motives and said they would not turn away white people or all non Sioux to their Sun Dances etc., because they were there to help all the people. This is a fact...we need to stop this. One way or another, heck all the Sioux should put a patent on it if it needs to go that far. Our people were never missionaries. We were never told to carry our message to "OTHER" peoples to help them. This was was given to us by the White Buffalo Calf Lady for our people to flourish. NOTE, our people. Before we can help others we need to help ourselves. I posted this before, how many "white men" or women do we see make a yearly pilmigrage to our reservations once a year to play indian...and than they go home. OUR LEADERS allow this. They don't have a right to carry eagle feathers...we natives do. Are we going to lose this right by protecting these people. I do believe that...if these people want help. Look to their way. Their ancestors. Because that is who they are. We are Sioux...Born Sioux..to whatever..Lakota, Dakota, Nakota. Or, Cheyenne or Crow. As Sitting Bull once said...it is not necessary for Crow's to be Eagles. So, there needs to be a movement that all the spiritual leaders....of the Sioux stand behind. We need to get together for our people to flourish and help our own before we can help others...stand behind the Pipe given to us, as one. And not, one Lakota medicine man who still allows this or tries to protect a white man. Read our history, look at what happened to the Isanti in Minnesota..those men who risked their lives and protected white people...against their own. How were they treated...just like a Sioux. WE do not need to risk anything..we need to learn from our lessons and stand up to protect what we have left..our way of life. Soon, these white people will want to learn our language...once they make our way of life or religion empty..with too many medicine men...that will be another step they will take to become more authentic. So, those who do this, are really stealing, making fun of and killing our way of life. By deluting it with their own intrepretations. But, a movement is needed....where we have 1 chief and 1000 indians instead of 1000 chiefs and 1 indian.

Anonymous said...

WOW...how do you all like that statement made by Barbara..."I would make you bow to Rainbow's feet" wow. I don't know the Rainbow lady. But, just hearing the name Rainbow. I think that I know what she is about. Wow, the words used those. I just got to say respect. If Rainbow reall truely respects whatever way she is practicing. Than she should leave it alone. Out of respect. She should say..i am sorry. I am not a so-so. I am an ordinary white person. My ancestors are here....and I will ask them for help and go back to the name Jane or whatever name she gave up to go by Rainbow. That is where she needs to go to get help. Her ancestors..her home. Out of respect....she needs to do this. So there will be no more discussion about her..and people with burning retinas (that statement me laugh)looking at people for asking her to stop.

osage said...

What I hear from the many of you here is HATE. In this instance it is directed at Rainbow or Harley or Whities. This same hate was probably pointed at the bully that took your lunch money or the electric co. when they shut Your power off cause you didn't pay YOUR bill. Or the President because of this or that. Or maybe the ex partner who did not respect you. Or maybe YOU couldn't be respected. Couldn't respect yourself. Can't respect yourself. Hate is Hate and it represents a wound. When talk is made and it is fed by Hate, we Healers, Medicine People and Sacred Humans, white, red, black, yellow or hairy know that it represents a WOUND. Keep speaking hate! It just exposes more of your pain for all clairvoyants to SEE. If you don't like what other people do, do something else. Maybe all the haters need a Inipi to heal the Hate. You can lead it! Then see how long it takes for some other hater to come and start vommiting on your Sacred Ceremony to heal Hate. Then when you find yourself in that position, what do you do? Hate back or defend your PURPOSE. I honor those that have a PURPOSE and try to make a difference. White, black etc. Skin is not the point or the determining factor. If it is for you than so it be. I cannot just sit back and allow hate to attack people that have profound impacts on those that choose to be open to that. They do not point the finger at you and call you names. There is a reason for that. It is called Honor, Integrity and open Heart to Heart Communication. Our eyes would tell you truths a thousand fold these words. This happens to be the Battle Ground FOR NOW.

Anonymous said...

Great debate and some good information coming out here. Yes, stop the Hate..... If the Lakota want to own ceremonies, that is against the Sacred Law of this country. Go to Iraq if you want to live by those kind of laws..... Stephanie Rainbow Lightning Elk IS a mixed blood...... so what does that mean......? Who are her ancestors then? The mixed bloods are actually a majority here in America, not the the full bloods. Where is the voice of the mixed bloods......where is their paper? Their ceremonies? They come from a mixed mating practice which actually strengths the genetic links.

Marian Seiter said...

Reading all these comments makes me keenly aware of how many people are wounded, sad, and lost. The result of such sorrow is anger, hatred, fear and war. I come from a lineage of healers from wildcrafters to formally educated...I know my gifts come from my ancestors. We are all from one tribe or another whether we have been given a number or not should not be a validation of ancestor knowledge. Some of my ancestors were numbered and others not. As a general manager,I had an opportunity to work with Rainbow providing the land for the school. The healings that took place on the land and with the people over a year and a half were life changing. What comes to mind is honor, integrity, wholeness, respect, fairness and giving. My blessings to all that teach in the light and those who are challenged by the dark.

Anonymous said...

Hello. I see the term hate as well. Mixed Bloods, Full Bloods. If your a Atsina, Ojibwa or Cherokee. Be Atsina, Ojibwa or Cherokee. People now, grow up as one and try to be another. A white man tries to be something their not. Lying to themselves. Because, whoever they claim. They never live amongst them. They live in the cities where no one can say, "your not" or "you don't have the right" So, people, just be proud of who you are....and do that what was given to you. Don't move somewhere and than, sell whats not yours. If you want to be one of these Native Nations. Move amongst them. Where they live. Practice the way of life amongst them. Why is this not done? I know there is numerous reasons or excuses.

These Native Nations, have their sacred items still among them. Their "Bible" or their "Wall" is among them. Not in California or New York. Their HOME. So, if a non Native wants to find themselves, and walk this road. Move among them. That way, there will be no question as to whether or not they have the right.

If not, respect it enough to leave it alone. Because, going to a few sweat lodges and moving away amongst people who do need help and helping them, well, the results have been shown us. Mr James Arthur Ray. Others. So, Native Nations should not have to pick up and move to iraq to be who we are, in our home. We are not missionaries. We are born Native and therefore, are Native. If your white...we say..go back to Europe. That is just funny and ignorant to say...Iraq is the place to be for Natives who want to protect their way of life, not their religion. They are the same.

JimmieDAderhol said...

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Chippewa357 said...

Amayra Hamilton owner of A.V. Retreat says that by "listening to your heart she understands" and "highly appreciates the indigenous people and those that feel strongly connected with them"... try telling that to a children on Pine Ridge (or any other reservation) that is crying from hunger & cold and missing their grandmother that froze to death the previous winter, living in abject poverty GREATER THAN MANY 3rd world countries, living in a home that has broken windows, no basic appliance such as beds, refrigerators or stoves, that can't speak for herself here. Existing in a place where Internet & computers are RARE, where the per capita income is $5000 dollars a year. After having made the press comment "that acting and reacting based on judgment, anger and revenge is not honoring those who lost their lives" why should Amayra Hamilton suggest the focus only be toward "honoring the lives of the people who lost their lives"... attendees that shelled out 2 times the amount of money that it takes indigenous people living in abject poverty to make? Most of these indigenous people she says she "so admires" haven't the energy to think about "anger and revenge" they are too busy just trying to survive one more winter, much less have any access to a computer or help this woman make her fortune by "sharing with the world the beauty of their traditions, to share the 'essence and power of their ceremonies' and increase awareness"
Exactly what kind of "appreciation and connection" does this woman feel she has with indigenous peoples anyway???

Chippewa357 said...

Many indigenous people, if they even have access to a computer, would agree this was about religion. What seems to have happened at the Sedona 'sweat lodge' is extreme negligence, there was no real preparation, IE. no knowledgeable pipe carrier, etc., this appears to have been done out of pure greed. The organization preys upon the American baby boomer dream mentality by appealing to their aspirations of assumption of lifelong prosperity and entitlement stemming from the 1950's non Native mentality of the privileged middle class suburban baby boomers desire to continually aspire to be the first kid on the block with the very latest and greatest,, ironically, these same baby boomers who rejected their very own elders traditional values, regarding them as ignorantly old fashioned in favor of always adopting the newest fad, which now is to emulate Native American Spirituality and healing. Indians are healing from the atrocities that happened in our very own lifetimes as well as from inter generational trauma, and our healing methods are what is being falsely emulated in a great number of variations across the country. We didn't get our freedom of religion until the 1970's. How sad it is see our way of healing ourselves being marketed as a new age commodity with no knowledge or regard, but Indians such as myself are the elders now that pass our ways on for our youth that is still being affected through our onslaughts of atrocities and the results directly stemming from them. This organization is no different than those type of people who never fought for our country that hang around the local VFW collecting combat stories then claiming the honor & glory as their own, as if they themselves been through those battles. The way I see it is You can't claim the glory if you haven't been through the battle,,, If they had they would have some residual effects of PTSD, which by the way, only recently is being acknowledged as caused by Historical Trauma in a great number of Native Americans, and consequently they would understand the outrage this has caused Native Americans, not only because of the blatantly misappropriation of our spirituality but also the negative repercussions this may have on our most sacred practices. Our 'boundaries' been disregarded;
In James Arthur's website he stated the following but has since changed it, but had privously stated:

"This is the defining factor of real wealth... And, after all, isn't true Harmonic Wealth what you really want and deserve?...blending the latest and greatest findings....yet you've been brainwashed to think that only sweat and hard work will get you where you want to be. Here's a better way...Let the journey be your roadmap to an abundant, wealthy and fulfilled life.Yesterday's biggest nerd is today's richest man in the world (and he doesn't even have a college degree). You'll define and enforce your own boundaries without someone else telling you what they should be...There is no sacrifice only greater and more magnificent results, wealth, adventure and fulfillment."

In humanistic, relationship-based schools of therapy there are 'BOUNDARIES' in the therapeutic relationship, this however is not only being crossed by this organization but it is 'expected' of participants to completely and grossly disregard the true spirituality of very people it has been blatantly misappropriated,,, fabricated parodies such as this, are compromising to our culture simply because this was not about religion, but about a sad attempt to perquisite The Native American Church's peoples religious practices and beliefs under the assumption that by doing so will lead any person on to becoming "the richest man in the world".. with little or no education, effort or regard to anyone else's boundaries--- "wealth, adventure and fulfillment",, is not promoted by this organization or its followers as a religion, but is indeed copying a practice for the motivation of profit.

Chippewa357 said...

This man should be held accountable,,, how many of his followers have become the "richest man in the world and with no degree" as he claims on his website will happen? Where is the documentation or evidence of this claim?

Chippewa357 said...

How much money has the owner of The Angel Valley Retreat made off this sort of thing? How can someone say that they intend to "approach it from the heart and make something positive out this.. because the owner, quote: "highly appreciates the indigenous peoples and those who feel a strong connection with them", the owner stated, when many, 'STILL LIVING' Native American tribes exist in utter poverty all across the country watch as people such as these all across the country continue to capitalize upon them for the purpose of gaining enormous profit for themselves and those they are in partnership with by promoting the claim of obtaining extreme wealth, quote: "through the 'essence and power' of their ceremonies". The appreciation the owner states she has toward the indigenous peoples seems to be from the fact of having made enormous profit, because there is no documentation to support this claim that is being marketed, due to the fact that, quote: "through the 'essence and power' of their ceremonies" has been attempted to be marketed into avenue to profit and wealth. Where is the substantiation to this claim, if this is not an endeavor to commandeer something that cannot rightfully be bought? No practicing Native American has ever obtained extreme wealth this way, as J.A.R. pitched for sale on his site that "Yesterday's biggest nerd is today's richest man in the world (and he doesn't even have a college degree) ". If she truly "highly appreciates the indigenous peoples" as she claims other than for the fact of having made enormous sums of money through the years under the guise of pitching Native "essence and power" for the price of one of these retreats and partner to any numerous book profits & royalties, she would not state that she intends to "approach this.." by endeavoring to divert the focus solely into "honoring the people who lost their lives" then only merely making the statement that she merely acknowledges, quote: "the native traditions that feel offended and hurt" she would truly be ready to take the responsibility of being partner to not only the deaths but also to the Lakota lawsuit for which she unmistakably should also held legally accountable to.

Chippewa357 said...

Why do all these new agers that tell people that the sweat lodge has ALWAYS been a part of the world religion in every single culture on the planet yet ALWAYS names that IMPLIES INDIAN ORIGIN CAN ANYBODY ANSWER THAT????? WELL CAN YOU??? With hokey pokey ridiculous names like RAINBOW LIGHTNENING HAWK SOARING WITH EAGLE DOVES OF THE WOLF CLAN WITH BEAR MYSTERIES BESIDE SPIRIT MYSTIC VORTEX WALKING EAGLE TOO FULL OF BULLCRAP HE CAN'T FLY!!! Why not use your real names if you are not ashamed of who you really are??? Why try to do you always a little dance and shake a little rattle and have all of your new age mesmarized star struck glazed pigeyed groupies running to you to shoving bills at you like some stripper or prostiute tring to get down??? Why do you always flock to the white person who is like this, why do you want to be like them, and then stick your agrogant noses up at REAL INDIANS when they call you on it??? Why?? CAN ANYBODY ANSWER THAT?? I'LL TELL YOU WHY BECAUSE WE LAUGHT AT YOU!!! WE THINK YOU ARE RIDICULOUS,,, EMBARRASING,,,DEMEANING AND YOU KNOW THAT WE FEEL THAT WAY!!! THAT IS WHY YOU ALL TRY TO STICK TOGETHER AND TAKE EACH OTHERS SIDE BECAUSE YOU KNOW THAT REAL INDIANS REALLY THINK OF MONEY GRUBBING PIGS LIKE THAT!!!!!! JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF,,, THAT NOW YOU REJECT, THE GOD OF 'SOME' OF YOUR REAL ANCESTORS,, THROUGH THE MONEY FROM THE TABLES IN A RAGE AT HIS HOLY TEMPLE AND HE WOULD DO IT TODAY IF HE SEEN THE WAY ALL OF THE NEW AGE PROSISTUTES AND MONEY GRUBBERS ARE SHAKING THEIR RATTLES AND DOING A LITTLE DANCE AND BEATING THEIR DRUMS TRIYING TO GET DOWN WITH BUYING AND SELLING GOD. IF YOU WANT TO START YOU OWN RELIGION THEN USE YOUR REAL NAMES AND STOP IMPLYING ''INDIANESS'' Your ANCESTORS DID NOT GO TO SWEATLODGES THEY WERE PAGAN WHO WORSHIPPED FEMALE GODESSES AND PERFORMED FERTILITY RITES WITH THIER NEWBORNS TO INVOKE THE GODS AND GODDESSES FOR GOOD CROPS THEY DANCED AROUND THE PHALIC MAYPOLES WITH RIBBONS CONJURING SEXUAL SPIRITS WITH RUIN STONES THEY DID NOT GO TO INDIAN SWEATLODGES WITH NAMES LIKE WALKING EAGLE SPIRIT CLAN VORTEX ELK MOO TOO FULL OF BULLS-- HE CAN'T FLY!!!

Chippewa357 said...

NEW AGER'S ANCESTORS USED TO EVOKE THEIR OWN TRUE GODS AND GODDESSES FOR GOOD CROPS THEY DID THE 'BURNING MAN' HUMAN SACRIFICES, CANNIBALISM AND EXOGAOUS INCEST. DANCED AROUND THE PHALLIC MAYPOLES IN THE SPRING TIME WITH RIBBONS CONJURING SEXUAL DEITIES ERECTED TREES IN THEIR HOMES AND DECORATED THEM WITH THINGS AND BATHED ONCE A YEAR THEY HAD NAMES LIKE 'THE BRUCE' AND 'AESIR' & 'VANIR' THEY DID NOT GO TO INDIAN SWEATLODGES WITH NAMES LIKE ‘RAINBOW WALKING EAGLE SPIRIT CLAN’ TRYING TO SOAR WITH SOME ‘MYSTIC CANYON BEAR’ FLYING OUT OF SOME ‘VORTEX’ ALL WITH ‘ELK TALKING MOO’ TOO FULL OF BULLS– HE CAN’T FLY!!! WE DO NOT CARE TO COPY THEIR PRACTICES AND END UP DISTORTING THEM OUT OF IGNORANCE WHY ARE THEY FLOPPING AROUND ON STOLEN PROPERTY DISRUPTING OURS BECAUSE THEY ARE NOT HAPPY WITH THEIR OWN OR ELSE ASPIRING TO ENVIOUSLY TRANSFIGURE OURS INTO WHAT THEIRS USED TO BE??? THEN DESPISING THE REAL INDIAN BECAUSE THEY ARE NOT.

Grace said...

I'm just wondering why no one has mentioned the people who have died taking part in Ray's "sweatlodge" practices.

It seems to be a focus on money, money, money.

You're all as bad as each other.

Teneagles said...

I have been a Lakota Rain-caller since I was 8, and as a practitioner of medicine, there is a very fine line we walk to use the gift(s) Wakan Tanka gives us. We may not ask for anything as the medicine we received a gift must be given as a gift, but it is not man who enforces this. WT will make it stop working if this is violated, and this makes the person hollow. The gift becomes part of them just as if a limb, and to lose it in this manner is as bad as losing a limb.

I have been part of exposing a white man of false medicine in Montana, Tom Medicine Wolf. While he didn't charge, he made virtual slaves of his "students", emotionally and physically abusing them to get things he wanted or work done h didn't want to do, under them having to give or do them as they were his right as a "Medicine Man".

This is no different than asking for money, and if he ever had a gift, it was gone when I met him. He asked me to join his Council and of course I told him his medicine was not mine.

But the fine line still exists. In the days far past a man of medicine was constantly helping others, and had little time to fend for himself. This has not changed. In the days of past a Chief would wait until the medicine was gifted and the person of medicine had left, and would go the recipient and would tell them "A gift of venison" or "A gift of firewood for the sweat" or some other need of the person of medicine would be something that WT would honor in their future, and thus the needs were met, without the taint of need on the gist itself, nor the person of medicine losing the gift for "selling" it.

In today’s culture, very few remember the actions of the Chief in this manner, in fact many traditions like rain calling are looked upon by modern day ndn's as superstition. I had a Cousin on the Res once tell me that rain calling was only "good timing", as if one called till it rained, it could not be disproved that the call did it. I have since shown him otherwise, but the loss of knowledge in these matters has eroded the ndn way, and the faith that the way actually means anything at all, in our youth.

So it is no wonder in the "buy/sell" culture that has replaced the daily teachings out children used to get from wise grandparents, that the gift rule has been forgotten, nor that the Chiefs role has been forgotten. Only recently have a few people returned to acting as Chief in some medicine practitioners lives, and few of those willing to do it are a Chief of any recognized tribe.


The loss of this role meant the growth of the "buy/sell" mentality amongst true gifted practitioners who try to balance life’s needs against trying to deliver their gifts, many over a much larger territory than the old tribal boundaries limited them to. It also provided the opening necessary for frauds to enter in with their "teachings" for sale. I do not know the particulars of this person James Arthur Ray, nor upon which side did he begin his downward spiral, as a real gift holder, or a fraud, but one thing you can be sure, WT will sort him out, no matter what man does. I have to split this post to continue...

Te

Teneagles said...

As for the "who" the traditions and ceremony are for, that is a simple thing to discern. Many who were not born ndn have been adopted and taught at the council fires of every nation. In fact, one other story should be told.

In the days of Red Cloud, Roman Nose and Dull Knife a certain Colonel in the U S Army (I wont name him, but many know of whom I speak) declared that every Indian child under a certain age was to be killed, because "nits make lice". Until this time, settlers who encroached on the Black Hills and other places of sacred nature were killed outright, men and women alike.

Shortly after this Colonels order, the annual cross tribe security council was held, where the Chief’s and other representatives of the warrior class of each tribe met to decide how to deal with the invasions by other tribes, and as of late, the white man. The story was recounted to them all, and the threat of extinction was at last understood. Upon hearing this, Red Cloud, Roman Nose and Dull Knife, all respected warriors who had first hand dealings with the whites, were selected to go into ceremony to dream the solution.

After three days they were given the answer by WT, which was to change the way they waged war to the end. WT told them that one drop of Lakota blood would "sing to them" and call them to their heritage, and if ceremony was undertaken in their lifetime, it would "harmonize" all the rest of the blood in a person to the Red Road, making them a brother. Spirit could not be denied.

So it was decided that the women of the settlers who were caught, would be impregnated, not killed. Their blood would be mixed with the whites through marriage, and thus the Lakota would never be wiped from the earth no matter how hard the whites tried.

By this vision, and by them implementing this plan, it is proven that all who might have even one drop of Lakota blood in their veins were specifically supposed to be offered the chance at undertaking ceremony, to strengthen the ranks of the Lakota...

This is as it was...

Te

Anonymous said...

And what about this:

http://www.thoughts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32971

Anonymous said...

INTOXICATED JRI EMPLOYEES RESPONSIBLE FOR THREE DEATHS IN SEDONA

For about seven years, I believe, James Arthur Ray held these sweat lodge workshops with minor, acceptably understandable, incidents. There was one MAJOR difference at the Sedona sweat lodge workshop James Arthur Ray held in 2009:

There are rumors going around that a number of key JRI employees decided to have a little party and were intoxicated and on drugs while they were supposed to be fully sober and ready to help any and all people in the Sedona sweat lodge who needed help. This is why they were negligent in doing the jobs THEY WERE PAID TO DO!! It was THEIR JOB, not James Arthur Ray’s, to make certain everything was safe with the sweat lodge and running smoothly. Intoxicated JRI employees were careless in the administration of the duties THEY WERE PAID TO DO. As a result three people died and a number of people were hospitalized.

James Arthur Ray was sent to jail because of THEIR CRIMINAL NEGLIGENCE. Soon it will become public knowledge.

All I can say is that James Arthur Ray went to jail for something he did not do. THESES JRI EMPLOYEES are soon going to jail for their intoxicated criminal negligence that resulted in three deaths!

Anonymous said...

ANGEL VALLEY DESTROYS THE SWEAT LODGE

From the PDF file called The White Paper No 1 Page 4

http://jamesray.com/docs/White_Paper_No._1.PDF

“2 The reasons for this tragic accident may never be known, in part because we understand that Angel Valley subsequently destroyed the sweat lodge structure and coverings and buried the stones used in the ceremony. The loss of this critical environmental information may render determining the exact cause of death impossible, and the loss of this critical evidence from any “crime scene” would itself undermine and criminal charges against Mr. Ray.”

MY RESPONSE:

WHAT????? The authorities investigating this case did not confiscate exhibit A???

The yokels in charge of this criminal investigation are going to have a very difficult time explaining to the judge why they did not confiscate EXHIBIT A, in this Sedona investigation, and allowed the OBVIOUSLY GULITY PARTY which is ANGEL VALLEY to destroy the evidence.

ANGEL VALLEY constructed that sweat lodge, not James Arthur Ray, and Angel Valley apparently destroyed the evidence OBVIOUSLY because they knew if they did not THEY would be proven the guilty party in this criminal investigation!

Can you imagine what the media would have said if James Arthur Ray was caught destroying exhibit A in the Sedona criminal investigation? We would still be hearing the repercussions all over the media. So, you who are so vocal about guilt in this matter consider that ANGEL VALLEY destroyed the evidence. Why? Because THEY are obviously the guilty party in the Sedona tragedy. If they were completely innocent in this matter they would NOT have destroyed exhibit A in this criminal investigation.

Those in charge of this criminal investigation are going to really get in trouble for not confiscating that evidence. You can bet they will! It’s going to be very (((VERY))) embarrassing for them as they try to explain why they did not confiscate the evidence and allowed the obviously guilty party, in this tragedy (Angel Valley), to destroy that evidence.

It’s going to be brutal! I hope they televise the trial so we can all watch those idiots trying to explain to the judge why they did not confiscate exhibit A as evidence and allowed Angel Valley to destroy it.

Anonymous said...

Angel Valley knew what might be the consequences if anyone died using the sweat lodge THEY CONSTRUCTED. If they felt such a sweat lodge was too big THEY SHOULD NOT HAVE CONSTRUCTED IT!

So, to protect themselves they MUST have had people there to supervise its safe usage. Rumors have it that key people from Angel Valley and among the JRI employees had a little party and were intoxicated. This is the main reason they were negligent in their duties. Three people died as a result, James Arthur Ray went to jail for THEIR NEGLIGENT CRIME. Mr Ray lost his company and I wouldn’t be surprised if Angel Valley soon files for bankruptcy.

Those who were intoxicated and negligent in their important duties to help the people in the sweat lodge should be on trial, not James Arthur Ray!

hussam hawwa (real name) said...

hello..after reading many of the comments posted here, i have one to share: i have visited the site of stephanie lightning elk i dont know what and her turtle mystery website, and a personal opinion: the whiteness of their teeth shine greater than their eyes. i believe they are charlatans and spiritually deprived money lovers, just like most new-liberal-agers..im sorry for whoever was tricked by these ugly people..good day

Anonymous said...

What YOU don't understand is that the information was out there that people have been injured at his previously held sweat lodge workshops. If (((YOU))) are considering spending close to 10,000 dollars at his workshop it is YOUR RESPONSIBILITY to do the research. Once you find out that people have been injured in the past it is YOUR RESPONSIBILITY to decide whether or not you want to take YOUR chances, pay the money and sign the liability waiver. Once you do, it is YOUR RESPONSIBILITY to get out of the sweat lodge and STAY OUT if you feel you can't take the heat.

A New American Axiom:

If you can't take the heat, STAY OUT OF THE SWEAT LODGE!!

When you sign a liability waiver it is a matter of honor for you to keep the promise you made when you signed it. Only the dishonorable will try to get out of such an agreement they have signed. The dishonorable may win the legal case, but THEY DESERVE TO BURN IN HELL!!!!

Anonymous said...

(These are an important two posts. I created them on a Native American site:)

Let's put it this way:

A group of six White People decide to go to one of YOUR Native American sweat lodge ceremonies. You charge them nothing and there is no liability waiver to sign. One person ends up dying and two are hospitalized. The families of the White Person who died are determined to throw you in jail and the remainder of the White People are determined to testify against you and that your were negligent.

SHOULD THEY WIN THE CASE AND THROW YOU IN JAIL?

WHY NOT?

*I assume you are going to say they should not throw you in jail


MY COMMENT AFTER THEY TRIED TO CHANGE THE SUBJECT:

You think you are slick, but I am slicker than you! I know your tricks on trying to change the subject and not answering my direct questions. I feel like slapping your faces and demanding you answer my direct questions. Of course that is not possible, but that is how I feel when people like you try to change the subject. I have you psychologically checkmated and YOU KNOW IT!

And don't give me any crap that in my scenario the White Man would not lie under oath to make you look negligent when you were not negligent. You should know by now that lying comes easily to the 'fork-tongued' White Man.

Trying to take James Arthur Ray for every penny he has is DISHONORABLE!!!! Do you have any sense of honor left or are you determined to completely sink to the dishonorable ways of the White Man? The White Man has no real sense of honor. That is why contracts and treaties are written up. Such contracts and treaties are mandatory when dealing with the dishonorable. The honorable need no contract in order to keep the agreements they make with others. You only need contracts when dealing with the DISHONORABLE.

The White Man made a treaty with James Arthur Ray and the White Man should be made to abide by the treaty they signed and not find some dishonorable way around the treaty!

If you Native Americans are angry you should be angry that the White Man made a treaty with James Arthur Ray and now they are trying to break that treaty in ways not unlike how the White Man broke the treaties they made with the Native Americans.

How dare you sink to the level of White Man hypocrisy and pretend you care whether or not the White Man dies trying to emulate your sweat lodge ceremonies.

How dare you sink to the level of trying to rob James Arthur Ray by acting as though you have some sort of legal copyright on how sweat lodge ceremonies must be conducted.

The White Man may have robbed you of many things. Don't let the White Man also rob you of your sense of honor!'

WAKE UP!!!!!


http://www.anorak.co.uk/228444/media/interview-with-survior-of-james-arthur-rays-sedona-sweat-lodge.html/comment-page-4#comment-436804

Anonymous said...

The ABC program Mind Games, about James Arthur Ray, completely missed the MOST IMPORTANT aspects of this James Arthur Ray Sedona case and that is:

The Construction of the Sweat Lodge

They never even mentioned it!

So, what if they interviewed experts in the construction of sweat lodges and asked them about the construction of the sweat lodge at the Sedona Warrior Workshop? What if the experts TRUTHFULLY told ABC that sweat lodges are supposed to be covered with breathable material. What if the experts had said that a sweat lodge covered in waterproof tarps, like the one in Sedona, could indeed be dangerous enough to cause serious injury or even DEATH!!!

Then ABC would have logically asked: “Who built that sweat lodge?” From then on you would find out who the real culprits in this matter actually are and that is: Angel Valley!

Angel Valley built a dangerously unsafe sweat lodge

and if that wasn't bad enough

Before the James Arthur Ray trial began Angel Valley DESTROYED EXHIBIT 'A' IN THE CASE. Obviously, Angel Valley is doing it's best to destroy all evidence that would implicate them in this matter.

If James Arthur Ray was caught destroying that sweat lodge before his trial we wouldn't have heard the end of it! The media would have been all over him and he would probably still be in jail for attempting to destroy exhibit 'A' in the manslaughter case.

How would you have felt if ABC investigated this MOST IMPORTANT aspect to the James Arthur Ray Sedona tragedy?

Probably very different indeed!

Obviously, the ABC Mind Games program is biased. It was made to serve a hidden agenda. That's why they never bothered to investigate into the construction of the sweat lodge

Chances are NOT A SINGLE NATIVE AMERICAN who conducts sweat lodge ceremonies would publicly state that a sweat lodge covered with non-breathable, waterproof tarps was safe. NOT SO MUCH AS ONE NATIVE AMERICAN SWEAT LODGE LEADER IN THE WHOLE BLOODY WORLD!!!

ABC was obviously determined that the whole world view James Arthur Ray as guilty NO MATTER WHAT THE TRUTH MAY BE and they 'back-engineered' the program to serve this hidden agenda

SHAME ON YOU, ABC!!!

YOU ARE GUILTY AS HELL!!!

Anonymous said...

It is MY OPINION that James Arthur Ray was ignorant as to just how dangerous a sweat lodge holding about 60 could be. Angel Valley must have assured Mr Ray that such a sweat lodge would be no problem to build and it would be safe or else James Arthur Ray would not have paid them to build it. Mr Ray blindly trusted Angel Valley to be experts in these matters. This is where James Arthur Ray made his big mistake. Angel Valley should have told Mr Ray that they would NEVER build such a sweat lodge because it was extremely dangerous to do so. They should have told Mr Ray that they also would not allow ANYONE to build such a dangerous sweat lodge on THEIR PROPERTY, for liability reasons. Yes, Mr Ray was indeed ignorant to blindly trust Angel Valley when they told him they could safely build a sweat lodge that can hold 60 people. It was indeed blind ignorant trust in Angel Valley that led to the tragedy in Sedona's Angel Valley

Anonymous said...

I agree with the assessment it is indeed the Law of Attraction that is truly on trial here. People ask things like, 'Why did James Arthur Ray attract this to himself?' The real question is why did those PARTICULAR PARTICIPANTS attract this to THEMSELVES? Why did they refuse to listen to their bodies? They all knew they signed a liability waiver promising to take full responsibility for their actions at the workshop. They must have all heard that one man screaming at the top of his lungs, “I DON'T WANT TO DIE! I DON'T WANT TO DIE!!! There is NO EXCUSE for those people going back into the sweat lodge after a 10-15 minute round if they could not handle it. If your body is dying it will indeed let you know in unmistakable ways. If you refuse to listen to your body screaming that it is dying and you go back into a sweat lodge, after signing a liability waiver, you have no one else to blame but yourself! It is irrelevant who may be encouraging you to go back into the sweat lodge. It is YOUR LIFE and YOUR RESPONSIBILITY to protect YOURSELF!

I believe James Arthur Ray had held this particular workshop at Angel Valley for the past 7 years. He trusted Angel Valley, obviously, much more than he should. If I offered Angel Valley half a million dollars to build me gas chamber with the intent to kill people why would they not build it? Because Angel Valley knew THEY would be held responsible if anyone died in the structure THEY built on THEIR property. Angel Valley must have assured James Arthur Ray that the giant sweat lodge was safe and Mr Ray must have blindly trusted them. After all, THEY were the experts in building such a structure, not James Arthur Ray. Mr Ray was the expert in conducting a workshop, not in building a sweat lodge.

Anonymous said...

By stating “don't pay to pray” you should consider all the churches who ask for donations...after they pray. That's a lot of churches, right?

Anonymous said...

From my travels on the Internet, about the Sedona matter, I know how Native Americans would have reacted if a Native American went to that workshop and stayed in the sweat lodge unit he had to be hospitalized. The Native Americans would hold THAT PARTICULAR Native American fully responsible for his actions. They would have told THAT PARTICULAR Native American that he should have known better than to stay in a sweat lodge until he needed to be hospitalized. They would say that he got what he deserved for being an idiot! Yes indeed. That's how Native Americans would have reacted.

Anonymous said...

James Arthur Ray held that workshop at Angel Valley for, I believe, 7 years. He trusted Angel Valley when they OBVIOUSLY assured him they could build a safe sweat lodge that could hold about 60 people. From my research, I've learned it is CRAZY to build a sweat lodge that big where you cannot clearly see all the participants and be absolutely certain they are properly handling the heat. The only way the people in the back could possibly get any benefits from such a big sweat lodge is to cover the breathable material with non-breathable tarps and that is ((((INSANE)))). It was Angel Valley's responsibility to tell James Arthur Ray that they could not build a safe sweat lodge that could hold about 60 people. Angel Valley obviously assured James Arthur Ray that the sweat lodge was safe and Mr Ray is guilty of...blindly believing them. Still, the bottom line is that I feel certain James Arthur Ray takes FULL RESPONSIBILITY for (((HIS ACTIONS))) at that workshop and the people who signed the liability waivers PROMISING to take full responsibility for (((THEIR ACTIONS))) should be legally bound to abide by the treaty they signed. I'm sure we can agree that the White Man should (((NOT))) be allowed to get around promises made in the treaties they sign with others.

If you are a Native American you absolutely MUST agree with me on this: When the White Man makes a treaty with ANYONE, for Christ's sake, KEEP TO YOUR AGREEMENT, WHITE MAN!!!! All Native Americans should make absolutely certain that the White People are FORCED to abide by the treaty they signed when they went to that workshop. You owe it to your people to MAKE CERTAIN those White People don't find some slick way to get out of that treaty! Can't you see what you are doing if you endorse the White People breaking the treaty they signed? YOU MUST NOT ENDORSE THE WHITE MAN BREAKING THE TREATY THEY SIGNED!! You owe it to yourself and your people to make certain they keep to the treaty they signed WHETHER THEY LIKE IT OR NOT!

Anonymous said...

Make no mistake about it: Those who are chronically hateful, viciously vengeful and want bad things to happen to people they have never even met are indeed mentally deranged, spiritually sick people. The Healthy of Mind, Body & Spirit have hearts filled with love, health, happiness, forgiveness and a desire to see good things happen. It’s a fact!

Anonymous said...

James Arthur Ray Sweat Lodge Trial Vacated -- No New Date Set:

http://blogs.phoenixnewtimes.com/valleyfever/2010/07/james_arthur_ray_sweat_lodge_t.php

Anonymous said...

The Sedona Warrior Workshop was ONLY for honorable people who take responsibility for their actions. If you are a dishonorable person who refuses to take responsibility for your actions you had NO BUSINESS being at that workshop. You took an oath IN WRITING promising to take full responsibility for your actions at that workshop. You made a legal vow! If you are a 'pity me' person and you are certain your miserable lives are all someone else's fault you had no business being at that Warrior Workshop. That Sedona event was a veritable Spirit 'Boot Camp' for the honorable who keep their promises.

If you break your vow it will sabotage the rest of your lives. Whatever money you may get by breaking your vow will turn against you and you can bet it all that you won't enjoy it. The dishonorable don't deserve to enjoy the money they get by being dishonorable. YOU KNOW IN YOUR HEARTS THIS IS TRUE!

Anonymous said...

PART 1:

TO THE PARTICIPANTS OF THE SEDONA WARRIOR WORKSHOP:

So, you paid over $9,000.00 to go to that workshop. It had been held for, I believe, 7 years at Angel Valley. You obviously knew what you could basically expect. If you wanted to be indulged and pampered you could have used that money to go to a luxury holistic heath spa and been covered in organic mud then pampered with soothing massages. No, you didn't want that, right? You wanted to be pushed so that you could learn the difference between what you THINK you can endure and what you ACTUALLY can endure. You wanted to be able to make dramatic use of The Secret and see your daily lives transformed. Obviously, you couldn't get that from a luxury holistic health spa that caters to pampering you in all your cozy holistic indulgences. No, you paid the money and went to that workshop because YOU DIDN'T WANT TO PLAY IT SAFE. You wanted to be pushed out of your 'comfort zone' to the edge of your endurance. For this you knew you needed a Spiritual Drill Sergeant in order for you to reach your fullest potential and that's what you got. You must admit it takes a lot of guts for James Arthur Ray to create such a workshop. It's not as safe as a holistic 'pamper yourself' spa. Such a workshop is only for those who are serious about permanently changing their lives. The liability waiver made it clear enough that you might indeed be injured at that workshop. You might even die, yet you chose to PROMISE IN WRITING that you would take full responsibility for your actions when you attended that workshop and not hold James Arthur Ray or ANY of the JRI staff liable should you suffer injury and if you died your relatives could not sue over the matter. Ray should have had the attitude of a Marine Corps drill sergeant. He was nicer than that, right? Still, show me a Marine Corps drill sergeant who is always sweet and nice and I'll show you...a worthless drill sergeant.

Anonymous said...

PART 2: True warriors are honorable. They keep to the agreements they make and DON'T NEED a written contract to honor their agreements. You 'pity me' people who went to that workshop with the intent of breaking your promise if anything went wrong are a disgrace. You should not have been there. Supposed “warriors” who break their promises are actually losers pretending to be warriors. A drill sergeant is indeed going to shock you into a state of mind where you access your dormant potential. Once you sign the military agreement it's too late to change your mind about the matter. Sounds to me like you crybabies would make excellent military basic training boot camp washouts. You say you were pressured by Mr Ray to stay in the sweat lodge. What did you expect? For him to pressure you not to go in and build your endurance? GROW UP and take responsibility for your actions and your lives, people! Until you can say the Native American adage “It's a good day to die” with casual optimism and REALLY MEAN IT you will never amount to much on the path of Universal Knowledge. You should have gotten your lives in order, before you went, and been fully prepared to die at that workshop. There is no guarantee that you would not have died before you even arrived there! Next time spend your money on a self-indulgent holistic health spa for New Age weaklings that will pamper you with indulgent, holistic luxury. You don't belong at a workshop for the strong and the honorable.

I suggest you consider this: Angel Valley destroyed exhibit 'A' in the James Arthur Ray manslaughter case before it went to trial because...when they took the sweat lodge apart they found that the vinyl tarps covering the breathable material were somewhat melted. God forbid you people who went to the workshop would find that out! It would mean you suffered injury because of the fumes that came from those melting vinyl tarps. Angel Valley had no business constructing a sweat lodge and covering it with non-breathable vinyl tarps. THAT'S CRAZY!!! Study into sweat lodge construction and you will indeed find Native Americans agree that a sweat lodge MUST be covered with a breathable material. So, you didn't have enough air in the sweat lodge, eh? WHO THE HELL BUILT THAT DEATH TRAP COVERED WITH NON-BREATHABLE VINYL MATERIAL? Who assured James Arthur Ray that the sweat lodge was safe and didn't even bother to supply thermometers to make certain it didn't get too hot inside the structure,eh? These are the questions you really need to be asking...”warriors”

Anonymous said...

PART 2: True warriors are honorable. They keep to the agreements they make and DON'T NEED a written contract to honor their agreements. You 'pity me' people who went to that workshop with the intent of breaking your promise if anything went wrong are a disgrace. You should not have been there. Supposed “warriors” who break their promises are actually losers pretending to be warriors. A drill sergeant is indeed going to shock you into a state of mind where you access your dormant potential. Once you sign the military agreement it's too late to change your mind about the matter. Sounds to me like you crybabies would make excellent military basic training boot camp washouts. You say you were pressured by Mr Ray to stay in the sweat lodge. What did you expect? For him to pressure you not to go in and build your endurance? GROW UP and take responsibility for your actions and your lives, people! Until you can say the Native American adage “It's a good day to die” with casual optimism and REALLY MEAN IT you will never amount to much on the path of Universal Knowledge. You should have gotten your lives in order, before you went, and been fully prepared to die at that workshop. There is no guarantee that you would not have died before you even arrived there! Next time spend your money on a self-indulgent holistic health spa for New Age weaklings that will pamper you with indulgent, holistic luxury. You don't belong at a workshop for the strong and the honorable.

Anonymous said...

PART 3: I suggest you consider this: Angel Valley destroyed exhibit 'A' in the James Arthur Ray manslaughter case before it went to trial because...when they took the sweat lodge apart they found that the vinyl tarps covering the breathable material were somewhat melted. God forbid you people who went to the workshop would find that out! It would mean you suffered injury because of the fumes that came from those melting vinyl tarps. Angel Valley had no business constructing a sweat lodge and covering it with non-breathable vinyl tarps. THAT'S CRAZY!!! Study into sweat lodge construction and you will indeed find Native Americans agree that a sweat lodge MUST be covered with a breathable material. So, you didn't have enough air in the sweat lodge, eh? WHO THE HELL BUILT THAT DEATH TRAP COVERED WITH NON-BREATHABLE VINYL MATERIAL? Who assured James Arthur Ray that the sweat lodge was safe and didn't even bother to supply thermometers to make certain it didn't get too hot inside the structure,eh? These are the questions you really need to be asking...”warriors”

Anonymous said...

TO THE FAMILIES OF THOSE WHO LOST RELATIVES AT THE SEDONA WARRIOR WORKSHOP:I've had four near-death experiences and am just waiting for a NOBLE and HONORABLE opportunity to leave this world of body order and hardship with honor. I am indeed ready to die RIGHT NOW and, as any Samurai worth his salt will agree, the Native American adage is indeed correct: 'It is a good day to die'. I've read how those three who died at the warrior workshop were athletic, giving, wonderful people. Yes indeed! Well, wonderful people are honorable people. When an honorable person borrows something you don't have to chase him or her around to finally get what was borrowed back, right? When the dishonorable borrow something they 'conveniently' forget they borrowed it secretly hoping that you have forgotten so that they can, effectively, steal it. Those three who died were honorable people, right? They returned whatever they borrowed without having to be chased and hounded, right? Honorable people don't need contracts to keep to the agreements they make, right? And the three people who died were indeed 'honorable' people, right? Now, when you are dealing with the dishonorable even if they sign an agreement promising to do something they will try to find a way out of the agreement they signed and, chances are, you will have no choice except to take them to court in order for them to be FORCED to keep to the agreement they signed. The court systems are there because most are obviously dishonorable. HOWEVER, the three who died at the Sedona Warrior Workshop were not like that, right? They were honorable people, right? Well, I AM AN HONORABLE PERSON and I would have considered it an honor to die at that Warrior Workshop giving my best to become the very best person I can possibly become. That would have been an honorable and noble death indeed! I would not want to face eternity with my relatives doing their best to make me break the LEGAL PROMISE I made in the agreement I signed. If you are...

Anonymous said...

TO THE FAMILIES PART 2:

PART 2: I would not want to face eternity with my relatives doing their best to make me break the LEGAL PROMISE I made in the agreement I signed. If you are successful in getting the 'legal system to break the promises made in that agreement you stain the reputation of those who died at the Sedona Warrior Workshop. Their noble deaths will be stained by the fact that YOU made them break the sacred promise they made before they died honorably. Yes, the final promise a person keeps before he or she dies is indeed a 'sacred promise'.Is money more important to you than the honorable reputation of those brave warriors who died at the Sedona Warrior Workshop? Would you stain their entrance into the infinite by making them dishonorable liars who do not keep the promises they make? If money is more important to you than the honorable death of those you love then YOU ARE DISHONORABLE and you shame their memory by your selfish actions. UNDERSTAND THIS: just because some judge will allow you to be dishonorable and legally get away with it DOES NOT MAKE IT RIGHT!

Anonymous said...

TO THE FAMILIES PART 3:

PART 3: Oh, so you want someone to pay for the deaths of your loved ones? I don't blame you. Find out who destroyed exhibit 'A' in the James Arthur Ray manslaughter case and you will indeed have your culprits. Angel Valley DID NOT want anyone to discover that the vinyl tarps covering the sweat lodge were partly melted. That's why they destroyed exhibit 'A' in this case before it went to trial. Why, if James Arthur Ray was caught destroying exhibit 'A' in his case you and your kind would probably have lynched him from the nearest tree if you caught him before the police arrived! Study into the matter and you will find that the fumes from melting vinyl tarp material are indeed toxic. How convenient Angel Valley destroyed the evidence that would confirm this. How convenient indeed. A sign of Angel Valley's 'angel-like' innocence in this matter? I DON'T THINK SO!

Anonymous said...

Part 1

The rage is palatable, the betrayal enormous. Teneagles is correct about blood...it is those of us who did not enroll, those of us who are of the blood but not of the REZ who now outnumber the clans ON the Rez.

It is true that most cultures practiced a form of the sweat. Please note I did not say inipi ceremony. I said the Sweat. Most cultures acknowledge the value of the sweat. Now separated from their cultural practices, homogenized and diffused those people are seeking and they have no where to go. They fall victim to plastic shamans who promise them what they seek for a price. Where do you go for a sweat ceremony if you are white (no native blood) and your family has been away from tradition for hundreds of years, where do you go when your soul calls you to the sweat?

Anonymous said...

Part 2

And so I ask the bloods on the Rez why it is they were not proactive? Why is it that those who know, those who have held the wisdom of the elders and the traditions, why did you not reach out to the seekers? How is it possible the plastic shamans charging a fortune for a bastardized version of inipi ceremony was not stopped in his tracks LONG before now?

I can tell you...you have been asleep on the REZ. You are dispassionate and without hope. It is not the "NATIVE" way to be drunk and having sex in the streets at Pine Ridge. Is it the Native way for the elders there to refuse to participate in a blockade of alcohol coming onto the REZ? Those of us "bloods" of clans that never enrolled, never used our blood to gain land, but instead held on to our land, lost instead our culture...but it is US who look now to the despair on the REZ and bless our grandfathers and grandmothers for refusing to sell their blood to the government. We never recognized blood quantum until the government said we must.

This blood quantum has now become the force that divides us, as well as the culture. REZ indians see non Rez indians as having something to PROVE..Get a blood test, get a DNA test, oh too bad, we don't recognize DNA tests because it cannot delineate tribal affiliation...who is loosing out here? If ALL bloods came together we would come close to outnumbering "whites" our power would be immense...but REZ indians cannot over come the hate...of us who did not sell our blood.

Anonymous said...

Part 3

I am medicine woman, I have been my whole life. I am not enrolled, I can never BE enrolled. I have been called to and taught by many wonderful REZ teachers, and not a single dime was exchanged. I do not charge for my services, I also actually USE the wisdom and healing techniques of many cultures I have been blessed to be taught by. We have learned from each other. Grandmother said that for every illness there is a plant to cure it, and I am determined to learn about as many plants in this world as possible to carry that wisdom with me. I do not refuse to treat anyone, nor do I charge, but oddly the REZ indians suffering from severe diabetes and alcoholism would prefer to take the white man's medicine and go to the white man's church than learn about and use their own medicine. Occasionally I will take in an Rez skin for alchol rehab based on spiritual principles from the ancestors, but not many. Mostly, believe it or not, it's white people who come. The Indians are still drinking :(

Funny huh?

It is true that ALL cultures are inherently indigenous, the Celts had their shamans and plant medicines, their sweats and their prayer rituals. That culture is gone for the most part, as are the others associated with "white" skin.

Anonymous said...

Part 4

The furry that accompanied the accidental revelation that King Tut was white is incredible. The furry with which the Native Americans (Rez folk) attacked and tried to keep science from studying Kenniwick man was uncanny....but, he was white, Ainu...and his bones were far older than any other NA found..they wanted to suppress that, THEY are first nations...this nonsense can no longer be permitted to stand. We are far more intermixed than we are willing to acknowledge. Yes Kitchi made the four races and charged them each with care of the earth...and NOT ONE of us has done our job. Stop pointing fingers at the ball the white man dropped, when the red man also dropped his, the black man and yellow man the same. We are ALL guilty.

I am blood, I AM mixed blood, I am a wisdom keeper, a medicine woman, natural, it is a gift I give it freely....and I abhor people who charge what those folks were doing..for ANYTHING.

I have been blessed with an enormous world view because I have traveled so much. I have learned from Mayans, Embera, Guaymi, Kuna, Arawak, and Native Hawaiians as well as Ojibwa (I am a member of a band there) Cherokee, and Tuscarora, Saponi/Lumbee, and Lakotah. I was not a seeker..I lived and worked in those places and learned from their elders. I respect and honor the medicine and I do not sell what was freely given to me.

Spit on me, call me names refuse to allow me into ceremony (this has never happened EXCEPT from a white man who was making big money and knew I would know his ceremony was a sham) but do not question the direction of my heart and do not question the love for people, the desire to help them heal, to find their way.

Anonymous said...

Part 5

One young fellow I worked with was a martial artist but he was having trouble connecting with the way of the dojo. He came to me for advice and this is what I told him."son, where is your family from, what is your genetic memory, what does your DNA say that your are?" And he said "I am a celt". So I told him to seek out the way of the celtic warriors, learn how they prepared for battle, understand their war cries, and carry that knowledge with him into the ring. He called me later to thank me.

We all need to connect with a spiritual practice that resonates with us. The seekers of the sweat do not know where to go, they no longer remember who they are. The seekers of the plants do not know where to go, they have lost the knowledge of their ancestors.

We cannot send them back now. They are part of us, like it or not, Teneagles is right, their blood is often in our bodies, and ours in theirs.


It is no longer feasible to close the doors...I am stunned that the elders have not discovered how to use this for their benefit..for the benefit of ALL. If the elders at Pine Ridge had any sense they would create a camp ground. They would hold regular sweats that are generic in nature but still spiritually led (meaning reserve the sacred sweat for THE PEOPLE but create a way to offer the sweat to those seekers who have lost their own tradition.) Do not charge for the sweat, but do make a donation jar available. DO have services and other things on the REZ that the seekers will need and eagerly pay for. DO have education centers for the seekers so they understand that while they are offered the sweat they are not offered LAKOTAH sweat. Make plant medicine journey quests available to the seekers, but NOT the traditional ceremony. Surely people are smart enough to develop generic versions that are appropriate for NON BLOODS, but at the same time offers the benefits of the healing from the medicine to the seekers. Why deny the growth and healing WE KNOW is possible from the medicine to honest seekers..and there are plenty out there, just look at how much money that vile RAY person made.

Anonymous said...

Part 6

ALL cultures had their medicines, ALL, not just Native Americans and at one time ALL of us were indigenous. ALL. Pray for those who have lost their way, who no longer know how to do anything but kneel in the white man's "church" NATIVES INCLUDED, pray for those who no longer know how to bless the water, to pray for rain, to pray for the land, the crops, and THE PEOPLE. Kitchi-wa Manitou~ AHO PRAY for those who no longer know how to use drum medicine (ALL cultures used drums, did you know this?) PRAY for those who have forgotten the songs and dances of their ancestors. YOU have a gift they do not have. Because they came here and robbed us of our land they lost instead their souls, their traditions. Can they have ours? NO, but we CAN give them something. Why is it that no one has said this? Why is it that instead of trying to find a way to give the seekers what they want at a price WE can afford we have allowed the plastic shamans to rule?

The REZ bloods are loosing out on tremendous opportunity to not only mend fences and heal old wounds, but to enlighten and uplift those seekers who are lost and separated from all the knowledge of THEIR ancestors and there is no one left to teach them. Have pity on them instead. Our medicine people, our wisdom keepers knew the white people were coming, we knew they would try to wipe us out, but we WILL rise again..if we can put down the bottle, toss out the crappy diets that lead to diabetes, and get up on our feet and stop blaming dead white people...it is not the white man that puts the bottle to the mouth of a REZ skin now...it is by his or her own hand. How is it that you want people to respect your ways (and in this I am pointing at the closed REZ folks so hateful on here) when you do not respect yourselves enough to get UP?

Many white people have seen injustice and spoken for the natives when they could not speak for themselves (see google video UNREPENTANT). Why continue to carry the stereotype of ignorance and close mindedness related to the wounds of the past?

Spit on me some more, call me ignorant...Yes, we kept our blood, yes we kept our land, and yes I am likely alive today because we avoided the trail of tears, but I did loose something...my connection to my people, our ways, our songs, our dances our traditions..and I can never get that back. But I know who I am, I remember, it is in my DNA, my genetic memory...but I cannot undo my education, my travels and my tolerance, and I will NOT allow the hate to undo my love.

And to the person who used the incorrect definition of Shaman, that is old warrior lore, (sort of like old wives tale.) Please do a simple google search and you will see the origin of the word, and it has nothing to do with SHAM. If you are going to speak, speak the truth. If you are going to walk, walk in the way of light.

When are we going to stop the hate? It is up to us to help the seekers..why are we not pleased that those seekers are fleeing the white man's hateful god? Why do we not bless and honor this shift? Why are we not helping them?

Hate. And do we think Kitchi is proud of this?

When I use the phrase "white people" I am using it descriptively to describe the "need, greed, and ego" of all people, it does not matter what color you are, anyone can be "WHITE" ...as the early settlers were, coming here to flee oppression, and in turn created it.

We are all one...we do not have to pray the same prayer, or sing the same songs, but we can honor each other and join hands. How else can we heal the mother? How else can we honor the ancestors? Staying behind our own walls has not served us well.

Aho~

Anonymous said...

Part 6

ALL cultures had their medicines, ALL, not just native americans and at one time ALL of us were indigenous. ALL. Pray for those who have lost their way, who no longer know how to do anything but kneel in the white man's "church" NATIVES INCLUDED, pray for those who no longer know how to bless the water, to pray for rain, to pray for the land, the crops, and THE PEOPLE. Kitchi-wa Manitou~ AHO PRAY for those who no longer know how to use drum medicine (ALL cultures used drums, did you know this?) PRAY for those who have forgotten the songs and dances of their ancestors. YOU have a gift they do not have. Because they came here and robbed us of our land they lost instead their souls, their traditions. Can they have ours? NO, but we CAN give them something. Why is it that no one has said this? Why is it that instead of trying to find a way to give the seekers what they want at a price WE can afford we have allowed the plastic shamans to rule?

The REZ bloods are loosing out on tremendous opportunity to not only mend fences and heal old wounds, but to enlighten and uplift those seekers who are lost and separated from all the knowledge of THEIR ancestors and there is no one left to teach them. Have pity on them instead. Our medicine people, our wisdom keepers knew the white people were coming, we knew they would try to wipe us out, but we WILL rise again..if we can put down the bottle, toss out the crappy diets that lead to diabetes, and get up on our feet and stop blaming dead white people...it is not the white man that puts the bottle to the mouth of a REZ skin now...it is by his or her own hand. How is it that you want people to respect your ways (and in this I am pointing at the closed REZ folks so hateful on here) when you do not respect yourselves enough to get UP?

Many white people have seen injustice and spoken for the natives when they could not speak for themselves (see google video UNREPENTANT). Why continue to carry the stereotype of ignorance and close mindedness related to the wounds of the past?

Spit on me some more, call me ignorant...Yes, we kept our blood, yes we kept our land, and yes I am likely alive today because we avoided the trail of tears, but I did loose something...my connection to my people, our ways, our songs, our dances our traditions..and I can never get that back. But I know who I am, I remember, it is in my DNA, my genetic memory...but I cannot undo my education, my travels and my tolerance, and I will NOT allow the hate to undo my love.

And to the person who used the incorrect definition of Shaman, that is old warrior lore, (sort of like old wives tale.) Please do a simple google search and you will see the origin of the word, and it has nothing to do with SHAM. If you are going to speak, speak the truth. If you are going to walk, walk in the way of light.

When are we going to stop the hate? It is up to us to help the seekers..why are we not pleased that those seekers are fleeing the white man's hateful god? Why do we not bless and honor this shift? Why are we not helping them?

Hate. And do we think Kitchi is proud of this?

When I use the phrase "white people" I am using it descriptively to describe the "need, greed, and ego" of all people, it does not matter what color you are, anyone can be "WHITE" ...as the early settlers were, coming here to flee oppression, and in turn created it.

We are all one...we do not have to pray the same prayer, or sing the same songs, but we can honor each other and join hands. How else can we heal the mother? How else can we honor the ancestors? Staying behind our own walls has not served us well.

Aho~

Anonymous said...

Part 6

ALL cultures had their medicines, ALL, not just native americans and at one time ALL of us were indigenous. ALL. Pray for those who have lost their way, who no longer know how to do anything but kneel in the white man's "church" NATIVES INCLUDED, pray for those who no longer know how to bless the water, to pray for rain, to pray for the land, the crops, and THE PEOPLE. Kitchi-wa Manitou~ AHO PRAY for those who no longer know how to use drum medicine (ALL cultures used drums, did you know this?) PRAY for those who have forgotten the songs and dances of their ancestors. YOU have a gift they do not have. Because they came here and robbed us of our land they lost instead their souls, their traditions. Can they have ours? NO, but we CAN give them something. Why is it that no one has said this? Why is it that instead of trying to find a way to give the seekers what they want at a price WE can afford we have allowed the plastic shamans to rule?

The REZ bloods are loosing out on tremendous opportunity to not only mend fences and heal old wounds, but to enlighten and uplift those seekers who are lost and separated from all the knowledge of THEIR ancestors and there is no one left to teach them. Have pity on them instead. Our medicine people, our wisdom keepers knew the white people were coming, we knew they would try to wipe us out, but we WILL rise again..if we can put down the bottle, toss out the crappy diets that lead to diabetes, and get up on our feet and stop blaming dead white people...it is not the white man that puts the bottle to the mouth of a REZ skin now...it is by his or her own hand. How is it that you want people to respect your ways (and in this I am pointing at the closed REZ folks so hateful on here) when you do not respect yourselves enough to get UP?

Many white people have seen injustice and spoken for the natives when they could not speak for themselves (see google video UNREPENTANT). Why continue to carry the stereotype of ignorance and close mindedness related to the wounds of the past?

Anonymous said...

Part 7

Spit on me some more, call me ignorant...Yes, we kept our blood, yes we kept our land, and yes I am likely alive today because we avoided the trail of tears, but I did loose something...my connection to my people, our ways, our songs, our dances our traditions..and I can never get that back. But I know who I am, I remember, it is in my DNA, my genetic memory...but I cannot undo my education, my travels and my tolerance, and I will NOT allow the hate to undo my love.

And to the person who used the incorrect definition of Shaman, that is old warrior lore, (sort of like old wives tale.) Please do a simple google search and you will see the origin of the word, and it has nothing to do with SHAM. If you are going to speak, speak the truth. If you are going to walk, walk in the way of light.

When are we going to stop the hate? It is up to us to help the seekers..why are we not pleased that those seekers are fleeing the white man's hateful god? Why do we not bless and honor this shift? Why are we not helping them?

Hate. And do we think Kitchi is proud of this?

When I use the phrase "white people" I am using it descriptively to describe the "need, greed, and ego" of all people, it does not matter what color you are, anyone can be "WHITE" ...as the early settlers were, coming here to flee oppression, and in turn created it.

We are all one...we do not have to pray the same prayer, or sing the same songs, but we can honor each other and join hands. How else can we heal the mother? How else can we honor the ancestors? Staying behind our own walls has not served us well.

Aho~

Anonymous said...

Say whatever you like. If you are an honorable person you will keep to the agreements you make in writing. If you agree, in writing, to take full responsibility for your actions at a workshop then it is YOUR RESPONSIBILITY to decide whether or not you will go back into a sweat lodge, period. If you are a dishonorable person you will not agree with this simple truth, period.

Anonymous said...

Since you say you are a medicine woman I imagine you take full responsibility for your actions. If you attend ANY sweat lodge ceremony YOU take full responsibility for going back into a sweat lodge or not doing so, right? If for ANY REASON you feel you cannot handle it you don't go back in, right? It doesn't matter who may be encouraging you. If you don't feel up to it for ANY REASON you just don't go back into the sweat lodge, right? The decision to do so or not to do so is YOUR RESPONSIBILITY, right?

Anonymous said...

I'm sorry, but wise people do not encourage others to "spit" on them.

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BingoBabe said...

Nick White Swan (Lakota) does a good job of answering the annoying rhetoric we must endure from the "well intentioned" White seekers. He was interviewed on Red Town Radio a few days ago. I suggest that whoever is spamming this blog as "Anonymous" should listen to it and REMAIN QUIET for a long, long time while reflecting about it. You reveal yourself to be an extremely ignorant and arrogant person. White Swan comments that even the most articulate of us cannot communicate with the "True Belivers" such as Anonymous. They are exactly like any other mindless brainwashed cult member. Anonymous does not want to learn. He does not want to have a conversation. He is terrified that his most deeply indoctrinated beliefs are being torn down around him.

The link is here:

Nick White Swan On Red Town Radio ) on Selling Sacred Ceremony on year after the Sedona Sweat Lodge incident

http://www.blogtalkradio.com/redtownradio/2010/10/09/red-town-radio

Listen
Think
Listen again
Think again
remain silent
That's is the only way you will learn, Anonymous coward

A.R. said...

James Arthur Ray clearly was unethical on many levels, and deserves jail time.

I have been doing Inipi since 1994. The first one I did helped me realize I was a drug addict and probably should get help. I was abstaining at that time, but had not admitted I was an addict. I finally got serious in 2000 about recovery, began a rigorous 12 step program, and did Inipi run by a Native man in recovery, about once a week. My first year clean was difficult, especially months 4-9. Luckily I was learning some of the sacred songs. When I wanted to get loaded or die, I would sing the songs, and those awful feelings would fade. I believe the Inipi saved my life, and I am very grateful. What I learned that first year was that some Inipi were open to all races, (and some were Native-only) but should be run by a Native who was at least half-blood. I have followed that rule since then. I do not go to Native ceremonies led by white people. I made the mistake of going to a song practice circle led by a white man and I felt ill the next day, so I don't even do that. I found out in 2005 that I have Native blood; only about an eighth, and I don't know what Nation. I obviously know I am mostly white, still. It was just comforting to know.

I follow my heart and keep doing the sacred Inipi. I don't want to relapse. This coming Jan. 2nd I hope to celebrate 11 years clean. Since my last relapse was Dec. 31st, 1999, I like spending New Year's Eve in the sweatlodge. I follow the protocol I have been given, I donate to Native causes, and when people ask me to explain this and that about anything Native, I tell them to go ask a full-blood, don't ask me. I am just an addict in recovery who doesn't want to relapse.

If my story offends any Lakota person reading this, I am sorry. I will keep doing Inipi because I don't want to relapse. I am a simple preschool teacher living a simple life, and as an addict in recovery with some clean time, I am able to help other addicts in recovery. I want to live and keep doing my small part to help the planet. I hope you can understand.

Thanks,
A.R.

Anonymous said...

I just found this on a Native American website: “I know a medicine man who says the whole Sedona sweat lodge disaster was orchestrated by Native American shaman spirits who are angry at the white man. Now that they have given three human sacrifices to the spirit that whole area is more haunted than it has ever been. He says all the relatives have to do to prove this truth is to pitch a tent on the sites where their loved ones fasted for 36 hours. If they fast for about 24 hours on the same site alone and only using their cell phones in the event of an emergency, they will find that the area is indeed haunted and if they ask properly the Native American spirits will reveal that they did indeed kill the three people at the Sedona event. He says that anyone who wants to conduct this test must take full responsibility for whatever may happen as a result. It is not safe. They may indeed die of fright because those Native American shaman spirits hate white people and with good reason!

He also says any medicine man worth his salt will casually tell you that anyone who stays in a sweat lodge longer than he knows he should in order to impress others with how tough he is has no one else but himself to blame for whatever may happen as a result. What can I say? I agree!”

Anonymous said...

When I saw the testimony of, then Angel Valley employee, Ted Mercer who stated that on top of moving type blankets, electric blankets and vinyl tarps they placed a rubber tarp then sealed it off with rocks so that no air would get in I was shocked! I say there is no way the prosecution is going to find an expert sweat lodge builder who will testify, under oath, that the Angel Valley sweat lodge was a safe structure. They will testify that such a structure could indeed kill people. Sweat lodges are supposed to be covered with natural fiber blankets and allowed to breath. You don’t seal them off with rubber and make them air tight. That’s just plain crazy! If Mr Ray built such a structure on HIS property and people died as a result of using it he would be guilty of manslaughter. Angel Valley built the structure on THEIR property then didn’t properly supervise its use. If Mr Ray wanted too many hot rocks in the structure is was Angel Valley’s responsibility to make certain the structure THEY BUILT did not get too hot. Mr Ray legally protected himself from the irresponsible with an ironclad liability waiver legally binding under California law. It’s not right that an Arizona judge should decide whether or not a legally binding California liability waiver should be broken or not. The state of California should be having a very active role in this case! If Mr Ray forced people to go into the lodge and prevented them from leaving then the state of Arizona has grounds to break the liability waivers those people signed. If Mr Ray did not force people to enter the lodge and stay there, in a just legal system, the state of Arizona has no case. The liability waivers are valid and those who signed them are legally responsible for going into the sweat lodge and staying there, period. Whether the irresponsible like this fact or not is completely irrelevant. Besides, when the gym’s Zumba class is too full and I feel I can’t breathe it is my responsibility to get out. Whether or not everyone else can endure it is irrelevant. If I feel I can’t breathe I get out! That is my responsibility!

Anonymous said...

My ex-husband is taking our young son to these Deer Tribe events and even invited him into a sweat lodge. He claims its his religion and that he has a right to do so.

Gramma Knows said...

To Anonymous:

Did you learn nothing from the sweat lodge deaths?

The Deer Tribe Medicine Society is a fiction created by a well-known fraud and pervert, Harley “Swift Deer” Reagan. In my opinion, he is dangerous. Anyone claiming authority from him to teach anything about Native American spirituality is completely bogus.
Read this before you even consider letting a child become involved with these perverts.

http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=3542.0

http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=12.0

In my opinion, allowing your son to be involved with the Deer tribe in any way is tantamount to child abuse.

As a parent you should be RESPONSIBLE for the welfare of your son. You need to go to New Age Frauds Plastic shamans and check out anybody claiming to practice Native American spirituality.

http://www.newagefraud.org

(They are rarely wrong in identifying frauds and can explain why your son is in danger in detail)

By the way, you won’t find any “legitimate” teachers so don’t waste your time listening to the thousands of frauds who claim the right to “their religion.” They want your money. They don’t care about anything else and they are very, very good actors.

Every Native group has been issuing warnings about Reagan's Deer tribe/cult for years, so I'm surprised you've been able to keep your head in the sand about this fraud.

http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=17811&page=1

http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=50839&page=1

http://tribes.tribe.net/discoversacredsexuality/thread/d6a8946f-0849-4a94-8284-370e16c20d4a

http://www.sonomacountyfreepress.com/features/spirg-hagan.html

http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?action=printpage;topic=528.0

The one who knows the truth said...

To Ten Eagles-
You are so right and I can 100% confirm your suspicions. I know Tom Medicine Wolf very well. He is a very sick man, in fact a sociopath. He made the rounds out in California in the 1990s until he was uncovered as a fraud. He held many sweatlodges up in Northern California and told everyone he was the son of the Shosone leader, Rolling Thunder. When the community became suspicious of his stories, Rolling Thunder was contacted (before he passed away) and told my friend that HE KNEW this man and that he was VERY DANGEROUS and to get away from him as soon as possible. He said he was an imposter and fraud but has been traveling around the country telling everyone he was his son and a medicine man, all complete lies. He is a grifter and leaves a community as soon as the truth is found out. Do not trust him. Do not pay him money or support him. He is BAD medicine which, I am glad to know you have figured this out. I am writing to let your community know and ask you to please spread the word to as many of your brothers and sisters as you can. I don't want any more people to be hurt by him. Sincerely, The one who holds the truth